HNH: Yes that's right, but they are a very central piece, I mean they are right up there in terms of de-regulations, which is giving freedom to the giants to do as they like. Freeing up bank sto do as they like is probably at the very top. What I find is a lot of people get involved in looking at the banks, get too much in to narrow conspiracy theory, you know saying that it's just a question of a few families, you know it is Rockefellers and the Rothschilds and that is simply not true. We are talking about a system that, in effect ,has been embraced by virtually every Government, and where, all around the world, the average citizen has not been consulted and has not had any idea of what is actually happening. So it is a system that is in effect we are all, as it were, we're all guilty in a way in and way that we have been ignorant of how it works and the fact that we should be saying no and I think for me it's also more helpful, it may not sound that way, cause it sounds so big. But I think the awareness, the wake up that could come from a big picture campaign, awareness could spread very quickly and it is little bit of like ahah experience that can really help people become more focused on understanding a system which at first sight can seem overwhelming and complex, but we are now getting to the point where most people realize we do need fundamental change and that is going require a deeper understanding.
Rob: Well I tell you my experience, I have been doing this Bottom-up Radio show, I believe that, people need to understand the difference between Top down and Bottom up and they need to get clear that Bottom up is a the future of a healthy planet where bio-diversity and economics that support humans and life are happening , and that to me is so important.
HNH: I love it actually, I am going to use your language more because when you say Bottom Up Vs Top Down that is very good of saying the same thing that we are saying-- Global Vs Local Power and absolutely Bottom Up Vs Top Down, that's where it's at.
Rob: Because when you talk about staying Global in some way, that gets in to the characteristics of things that can be done Globally that can be done from a Bottom Up way. Like people becoming interdependent and co-operating and caring with each other and being local instead of centralized, being Egalitarian instead of hierarchical, all of those are what I consider Bottom Up Values that we are part of who we are in small healthy local communities and indigenous cultures.
HNH: Yes, but I also think that this big distinction we have to make is between understanding the difference between Global information exchange and co-operation Vs Global economic activity. It doesn't mean that there wouldn't be some global trade, but we are talking about handing power into the top down Global economic institution. We will need certain top down protection, so that in this era where we have developed these hideous technologies we are going to need global collaboration to protect the environment and to protect the Human Rights. Again, global collaboration for protection of the environment and human rights is very important. And this is where often the political left from my point of view gets confused-- they are opposed, often, to localization, because they think it means retreat in to some tiny little zenophobic, white privileged something or rather. I think many of them just haven't read enough or understood what we are talking about. But what we are talking about is the economic power and concentration that needs to be broken up and de-centralized in order, as you say, to have healthy human beings, both physically and emotionally healthy, as well as healthy eco system and to do that we will need to put in place and not only put in place but actually we have certain Treaties that protect biodiversity and so on, but they have no teeth, they have not actually been enforced. So what has been the rule of the day that has been the economic priorities, so that needs to be revised.
Rob: You said something when you talked the other day, you said "we need to distinguish between collaboration to protect mother Earth and collaboration to increase the scale of economic activity."
HNH: Yes
Rob: This is the Rob Kall Bottom-up Radio Show WNJC 1360 AM, you've been listening to Helena Norberg Hodge, who is organizing an incredible conference you can find out about at localfutures.org, she is a Producer and Co-Director of a wonderful movie that I have watched four times at least, I recommend it very, very, very, very highly and it's called Economics of Happiness and you can find out about that on theeconomicsofhappiness.org.
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