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June 27, 2008 at 10:18:13
Promoted to Headline (H3) on 6/27/08: by Edwin Rutsch Page 1 of 3 page(s) |
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Religious factions will go on imposing their will on others unless the decent people connected to them recognize that religion has no place in public policy. They must learn to make their views known without trying to make their views the only alternatives. Barry Goldwater (see this post with all it's images here) James Dobson is a major leader of the social conservatives. He is considered one of the more moderate of the 'Value Voters' leaders because he doesn't support spanking any child under the age of 18 months, while other conservative leaders do. 
James Dobson
Dobson is now attacking Barrack Obama for "deliberately distorting the Bible" and "dragging biblical understanding through the gutter." Isn't it time for progressives to start unmasking how the values of the conservative movement have failed? Isn't it time to ask them some questions about their values? How about asking your family, friends, neighbors, colleges, etc, "Have Conservative Values Failed?"
Let's raise the question. It should be easy for anyone to answer. It's time for progressives to take back the values debate and promote an open and honest discussion about values. Document what you find out and share it with the rest of us.
Here are some people who have taken up the challenge.
Failed Conservative Values: Elaine Charkowski on Patriarchy Family Values
Elaine Charkowski talked with me about how conservative values have failed. She says, Conservative Family Values is about patriarchy and fear of authority. It’s about not using your own mind and woman are to be subservient to the man. The type of power used is random punishment and reward, which studies show is the best way to drive animals crazy.
View @:Democracyforamerica.com - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com
Failed Conservative Values: Louise Specht on Hierarchy Authoritarian Narcissism
I asked Louise Specht about the the failure of conservative values. She addressed the hierarchal and authoritarian nature of conservativism and how this can lead to narcissism for the people at the top. Steven Colbert does a great job of imitating a conservative on the Colbert Report. I just saw him begin his show lately by saying, "Did I tell you I love me lately?" He hit's the nail on the head, as does Louise.
View @:Democracyforamerica.com - Opednews.com -Dailykos.com - Groups.yahoo
Failed Conservative Values: Dona Ridgeway on Authoritarianism
Donna Ridgeway is a blogger living in the Santa Cruz, California area. She was raised republican and was in the military, but then started questioning. She says the Failed Conservative Value is authoritarianism, it's a lose lose situation because if the authoritarian fails, everything fails. However she sees a lot of problems with progressives as well. There's a lot of egos with progressives and herding cats is hard.
View @: Democracyforamerica.com - Opednews - Dailykos - Groups.yahoo
Failed Conservative Values: Arianna Huffington on Family Values Hypocrisy
Arianna Huffington is a well know progressive speaker and activist. She started the popular Huffington Post website and it seems you can't turn on a progressive TV show without her popping up on it and taking a swipe at the conservatives. I saw Arianna at our local bookstore where she was promoting her new book, The Right is Wrong. During the Q and A, I asked her how conservative values have failed. She had plenty to say.
View @:Democracyforamerica.com - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com
Failed Conservative Values: They're Not Working - George Lakoff
George Lakoff is a linguistics professor at UC Berkeley and author of numerous books on metaphors, framing and politics. Howard Dean has called him, "one of the most influential political thinkers of the progressive movement." George was at our local bookstore talking about his latest book, The Political Mind. During the question and answer period, I asked him if he personally feels that Conservative Values have Failed and if so, how have they failed?
View @: Democracyforamerica.com - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com
Failed Conservative Values: David Sirota on Economic Darwinism
David Sirota came and talked about his new book, 'The Uprising' at the Oakland Democracy for America meet-up on June 11, 2008. During the Q and A, I asked David how conservative values have failed and he talked about the failure of Conservative Economic Darwinism. The full video of his 70 minute talk and slideshow is now online.
View @: Democracyforamerica.com - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com
Attack of the Anaconda - Failed Conservative Values Metaphors
Sometimes it helps to use a bit of imagination and creativity to look at things in a different way to shake up the status quo and change mindsets. I've been asking people to create a metaphor for the Failed Conservative Values. For example, if conservative values were a type of machine, or land, or animal, etc., what would they be like? Here are some of the images people came up with; anaconda, meat grinder, quicksand and mud stuck elephant.
View @: Democracyforamerica.com - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com
Failed Conservative Values: Nancy Kops on Selfishness 
I interviewed Nancy Kops and asked her about Failed Conservative Values and what are Progressive Values. She feels caring is the most important liberal-progressive value. She knows many conservatives and finds them to have good hearts and be very caring about the people around them. However, she can’t figure out why they can be attracted to the Republican Party. She thinks they just don't see the big picture.
View @: Democracyforamerica.com - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com
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Take the poll
What is the worst of the Failed Conservative Values that James Dobson exemplifies? here Worst of the Failed Conservative Values that James Dobson exemplifies? by Edwin Rutsch (64 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 155 comments) on Friday, Jun 27, 2008 at 10:43:48 AM  (0+)
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you really did my work for me... thank you.
Failed Conservative Values: Louise Specht on Hierarchy Authoritarian Narcissism Another thing that I noticed, is that you are chronicling human failure as opposed to ideological failure. (another reason to torpedo your conclusions....) Allow me to help you. If you wanted to chronicle a failed political policy, you could, conceivably refer to the US Department of Education. It is an organization whose failure is rewarded by increases in funding. However, that is not a Conservative political policy... You could refer to the state of the Canadian Socialized Medicine system, but socialized medicine is NOT a Conservative ideal... Ciao, CZ by steve scheetz (4 articles, 0 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 829 comments [52 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Friday, Jun 27, 2008 at 12:42:21 PM (0+)
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Reply: it's not about policy but
the underlying values from which it flows. If you don't see the authoritarianism of Dick Cheney and James Dobson for example.. then I'd respectfully have to say you can't see authoritarianism in action. as a lived embodied and expressed value. Would you say Dick Cheney and James Dobson value and express authoritarianism ? (thanks for the comment) by Edwin Rutsch (64 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 155 comments) on Friday, Jun 27, 2008 at 1:42:41 PM (0+)
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POLL DOES NOT MAKE SENSE
For your poll to make sense, you would have to list actual conservative values rather than the negative default options you have listed. For instance, Dobson believes in smaller government; less taxation; fewer social programs organized through the government and more organized through the church; stricter discipline in the schools; prayer in the schools; far less governmental regulation; treating Christianity on the same basis as Judaism and Islam in the public sphere; no limits on campaign finance; trickle down economics; a robust military; no abortions; making divorce more difficult to obtain; increasing jail sentences; etc.. Then we could choose which value has most failed. But you have not listed values, but rather assigned predesignated negative euphemisms that amount to nothing more than ad hominem attacks. While I would have to mark "all of the above" in the poll you have offered when it comes to the pitiful Reverend, he ought to have something of a fair hearing (before he hangs). by W.M.L. (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 537 comments [52 recommended, 1 rejected]) on Friday, Jun 27, 2008 at 7:10:58 PM (0+)
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Reply: most all of what you mention are 'principles', ie
1. smaller government; far less governmental But, the question is. What are the actual values behind each of those principles? Values are the bedrocks that principles are made of. Do you want to hazard a guess what the values behind those principles are? thanks for the post and your fairness. by Edwin Rutsch (64 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 155 comments) on Friday, Jun 27, 2008 at 7:38:24 PM (0+)
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Reply: VALUES
Considered that way, I think Dobson has the same values mostly as you or me. The question seldom is whether progressives and conservatives have different goals, but rather how to obtain those goals. Most Americans want the best for the country, themselves, and their neighbors and friends. That means they want strong families, good jobs, good health, peace on earth, and a decent standard of living. The issues we argue over is the means by which these things can be obtained. Dobson believes a strong family is obtained when the man loves his wife like Christ loved the Church (Christ died on the cross for the Church). On the other hand, he believes that a wife need not love her husband, but that she should allow him to lead the family spiritually. He believes this because he takes the Bible literally and that is what it literally states. You have attached the word "patriarchy" to the idea of being willing to die for your wife in exchange for spiritual leadership. Dobson happens to be a very poor choice to represent Christian views on this issue though, as he is caught up in the military industrial complex, the Bush empire, and the Rev. Sun Myung Moon's vast empire. by W.M.L. (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 537 comments [52 recommended, 1 rejected]) on Saturday, Jun 28, 2008 at 12:27:21 AM (0+)
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Reply: your mixing a lot of concepts together.
you have values, goals, policies, etc. all being used interchangeably. It's a bit much to untangle. Perhaps we could start with the question, Have conservative values failed? I'd be intreseted to hear how you answer that? It would help me understand where you're coming from. thanks for your comments. by Edwin Rutsch (64 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 155 comments) on Saturday, Jun 28, 2008 at 12:51:32 AM (0+)
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Corporatism is not Conservatism.
Corporatism is crookism. When capitalism grows to big so that it is only a form of racketeering, it is crookism. Real conservatives don't like crooks any more than liberals do. George Carlin was a real conservative who stood up to liars and bullies as a matter of course. Fundanazi preachers are real radical Republicans who epitomize the meaning of "liar and bully". by John Hanks (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 1760 comments [39 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Saturday, Jun 28, 2008 at 11:05:02 AM (0+)
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