As hard as it is for me to agree, I do.  If we are one of the last countries to "play by the rules", maybe all will be lost.

by jackied (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 2 comments) on Sunday, Aug 19, 2007 at 11:48:22 AM

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That's my basic theory.  If a man who was born in the United States and was a US citizen his entire life can be treated this way, any of us can.  It will always lurk in our subconscious minds, causing us to hesitate, even if unaware.  It's like Kent State in 1970.  That deep-seated fear that they might actually kill protestors again is, in my view, as responsible as anything else for our apparent complacency in the face of an orchestrated march toward authoritarian rule.

by Bruce Allen Morris (37 articles, 0 quicklinks, 10 diaries, 55 comments) on Sunday, Aug 19, 2007 at 11:58:13 AM

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Not just by the treatment of an American citizen at the hands of a corrupt and morally bankrupt government. Not just that the treatment of Mr. Padilla is echoed at Guantanemo and Abhu Graib , at who knows how many such prisons around the world. Not just that nothing in our famed and false free press reports anything close to the truths of our actions.

After a forty year  span of political activism, of working with neighborhoods groups, with local politicos, with State officials, with Federal emplyees to effect positive changes I am sickened by the apathy and indifference of my fellow Americans. A real American could not be silent while such crimes are committed, have been committed far longer than this little half pint dry drunk pResident has had the White House given to him, a real American would stand up and be counted.

Oh shut up Ardee, I cant hear the TV......

by ardee D. (6 articles, 4 quicklinks, 1 diaries, 2377 comments) on Sunday, Aug 19, 2007 at 12:05:35 PM

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So, the Padilla affair is a stain on the American fabric? LOL. Have you seen the fabric of America lately? It looks and smells like a very old, stained mattress on a crack house floor on which something gave a difficult birth.

I wouldn't worry about smudging America's legacy or getting another unconscionable stain or spot on it. This culture needs more than a little Wisk. It needs an exorcist, or an insurance fire. You can't polish a turd.

These people began staining your democracy even before the recounts, long before they assumed office. And they have been squatting over and staining it continually since.

So, yes, this is unacceptable and it blemishes America  - like one more zit on the face of a teen with fulminating acne. But you say it as if it hasn't been the daily SOP for the last seven years. Next we'll be hearing that Bush lied or stole, and it's threatening his credibility.

by Yaybob (12 articles, 0 quicklinks, 1 diaries, 174 comments) on Sunday, Aug 19, 2007 at 5:52:26 PM

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Hardly a skid-mark , more a layer of doo-doo neck deep on a giraffe. If it is of any comfort the rest of the US's "friends" seem to be quite happy to condone and follow similar routes, ostensibly also in the name of preservation of democracy and freedom.

What is America afraid of, that it is prepared to throw away all its so dearly won freedoms?  The amount of damage both in terms of lives (and their inherent worth- nothing)and in terms of gold from terrorism is minuscule when compared to the losses due to errors of omission and commission on the part of governments and corporations.

The WTC destruction cost about 4000 lives. The loss of life is about the same as US road kill for 2 weeks, a number that nobody gets too excited about. The estimated cost in gold was around 100 billion, less than 2 months cost for financing the Iraqi fiasco.

What makes the populations of western countries so blind? Is it that the possession of material things is so important that they are prepared to sacrifice the important things like freedom of speech, freedom to dissent, freedom to protest in a lawful fashion.  Maybe the desire for revenge for a more perceived than real blow to the American ego blinds them?  Maybe the enormous profits to be made in "fighting" terrorism help to drive the propaganda machine?

It is hard to reconcile America's apparent faith in God and supposed eternal bliss in the afterlife with the psychotic fear of terrorists on earth. Perhaps the belief in the promises of faith lead to belief in the promises of government?

by bird (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 11 comments) on Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 10:14:07 AM

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Before, when the United States was still a free country under a just Constitution, it was a refuge from a cruel, capricious world.  Now there is no refuge.  No one who dissents against the policies of this present government should feel secure.  There is the chance of being treated just as Padilla was.  So, what would you do?  Go to Canada or Europe?  They would kidnap you if they wanted.  So there is no refuge anywhere anymore.

Our only hope is to beat back the establishment which is bound and determined to continue using computers to steal the vote.  We need to hand count our ballots, which will result in the wholesale dumping of the neo-cons out of both Congress and the White House.   And then we have to spend as long as it takes to investigate these instigators of tyranny.  We need to clean house, or be thrown out into the cold.

by GitarChris (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 142 comments) on Sunday, Aug 19, 2007 at 11:48:12 PM

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As An Aussie I should be saying it can't happen here.....yet but with The Dr Haneef debarcle  who knows.

Dr Haneef (an indian national) came to Aus to work in our understaffed hospital system (lack of local Drs due to Right Wing Govt policies).

His wife had a baby in India at short notice he decided to go home on a ticket organized from India (I wonder why? Maybe his budding internal terrorist baby might have been the motive).

In UK a second cousin of his was involved in failed attempt to crash and bomb Glasgow airport. Before the attemt one of the would be terrorists rang another cousin in Manchester. It so happened that the cousin recieving the call  did so on a sim given to him by Dr Hanneef before he left the UK  6 months earlier because it has credit on it.  Enter our Fed police they took Haneef from his plane home and kept him inisolation for 14 days questioning him .

During this time selected portions of his interrogation and dubious fact and misinformation was leaked to the press. Snipits claimed that Dr Haneef had once lived with one of the wannabe terrorist... he hadn't. Onother stated that Haneef's sim had been in the actual vehicle that rammed the airport..it wasn't. He cooperated politely but gave nothing new( as a guess, perhaps he didn't know anything.) Once the legal time expired he was brought before a superior court (supreme court) judge who reviewed the evidence was critical of the sloppyness of the case and determined that there wasn't enough evidence to maintain any charge let alone a case against Dr Harneef. He was released.

Now Haneef was then arrested by Immigration and held in isolation. The Minister (Secretary ) saying he had information too sensitive for the judge. (Prepared by the very same Federal Police who were criticised by the judge)

Dr Haneef's work visa was cancelled on the grounds that he was of dubious character?!. He was released and surprise, surprise he hopped a plane home where he was hailed as a hero.Haneef has petitioned the courts to have his visa reinstated (god knows why unless it may have bearing on his ability to gain a visa for other countries). The Fed Police also rousted another Indian Dr because they worked together!

It would appear that our Fed Police had formed an opinion regardless of how tenuous the fact were  and opperated from there ('whoopee weve got a terrorist here here comes my next promotion?')

This is what happens when right wing paranoia reigns supreme no one is game to tell the emperor he has no clothes.

Well we botched that one but have no fear GOPites I'm sure well get it right next time.

by Andris (4 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 531 comments) on Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 12:08:48 AM

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Unfortunately, there is evidence that the same infection that has overcome the American government is present, albeit in an earlier stage, in Australia, the UK and Canada as well. It's hard to believe that it doesn't also affect the rest of western European to some extent, given that the principal international bankers are European, although I'm only aware of an ugly conservative presence in France.

I think that the world is headed for a very dark period of domination and exploitation. Personally, I'm glad that my life is more than half over. I'm hoping for a comet that upends civilization without completely eliminating humanity or its books.

by Yaybob (12 articles, 0 quicklinks, 1 diaries, 174 comments) on Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 8:35:27 AM

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