Last Friday, Code Pink was granted a meeting with Chairman John Conyers, in which he challenged the intrepid, peace-lovin' protesters to explain to him why he should dismiss the five most common reasons indicating that impeachment is not possible. The five reasons are below.
John Conyers’ five [paraphrased] reasons for not impeaching:I’m going to list them twice, first with my rebuttals and then with the rebuttals given on dailykos.Reasons by Rob Kall
• Reason one: While the majority of people in this country want Bush gone, they don't want impeachment.
Rebuttal: Most people don’t understand that there are two parts to impeachment—hearings that Bush can claim executive privilege for, and the senate trial. People don’t want to deal with the senate trial.The polls Conyers may be seeing that show opposition to impeachment don’t explain this. They allow for ignorance.
• Reason two: The corporate media will slay us.
Rebuttal: No. The corporate media will get tons of cheap, free content that will provide high interest, attention grabbing news. They will love it. Sure, FOX News will criticize, but they do that 24/7 anyway.
• Reason three: Not enough time.
Rebuttal:The timing is perfect. The coverage will show the dirt, corruption, lies and criminality of Bush, Cheney and their republican enablers and will do devastating damage to McCain, GOP incumbents and the image of the Republican party. If impeachment hearings were started before June, they may have actually been TOO early, since Republicans could have cleaned up the mess and moved on. Now it is pretty much too late, even if the Republicans give Bush and Cheney the boot.
• Reason four: Not enough votes.
Rebuttal:The Dems control the hearings in the house. The “not enough votes” concern is all about the senate. The Dems can keep the trial from ever happening by keeping hearings going. That’s why we want impeachment, for the devastating hearings that will damage the Republicans. Forget about the votes. They will never happen. The Republicans will do “the Walk” to the whitehouse to tell Cheney and Bush they have to resign or the Republican party will be destroyed.
• Reason five: It will most likely cost the Democrats the election.
Rebuttal: Total cowardly, unsubstantiated nonsense. Impeachment hearings will increase the factor Obama wins against McCain by and will help more Dems beat Republican incumbents. The news coverage will be riveting and will cast an incredbly ugly light upon the Republicans. My poll, posted last week on OpEdNews.com, Will Impeachment Hearings Help or Hurt Obama and Democrats This Year? drew a 94% response saying that it would HELP, not hurt the democrats.
Rebuttals given by Markthshark on dailykos.
• Reason one: While the majority of people in this country want Bush gone, they don't want impeachment.
Rebuttal: According to the Institute for Public Accuracy, a poll done by the American Research Group back in July 2007 indicated that 54% wanted to impeach Dick Cheney and 40% did not. In the same poll, 45% said they wanted to see George W. Bush impeached and 46% did not. Democrats.com has a whole series of polls from last year. Times have changed and percentages are most likely even higher in favor of impeachment now with recent disclosures from the long-awaited Senate Select Intelligence Committee Phase Two report and Scott McClellan’s new book What Happened.
• Reason two: The corporate media will slay us.
Rebuttal: Consider the source. I’m not trying to be trite here but the media in America simply have no credibility anymore because of how they failed to ask the hard questions during the run up to the war, and they’ve continued their dereliction of duties as the 4th branch of our government by not holding this scofflaw administration accountable for their crimes. Besides, impeachment hearings will be broadcast on C-Span full time and cable news part time. It's kind of difficult to refute the evidence once it's laid out on the proverbial table.
Rob Kall is executive editor and publisher of OpEdNews.com, President of Futurehealth, Inc, inventor . He is also published regularly on the Huffingtonpost.com. He is a frequent Speaker on Politics, Impeachment, The art, science and power of story, heroes and the hero's journey, Positive Psychology, Stress, Biofeedback and a wide range of subjects. He is a campaign consultant specializing in tapping the power of stories for issue positioning, stump speeches and debates. He recently retired as organizer of several conferences, including StoryCon, the Summit Meeting on the Art, Science and Application of Story and The Winter Brain Meeting on neurofeedback, biofeedback, Optimal Functioning and Positive Psychology. See more of his articles here and, older ones, here.
To learn more about me and OpEdNews.com, check out this article.
and there are Rob's quotes, here.
To Watch me on youtube, having a lively conversation with John Conyers, Chair of the House Judiciary committee, click here Now, wouldn't you like to see me on the political news shows, representing progressives. If so, tell your favorite shows to bring me on and refer them to this youtube video
My radio show, The Rob Kall Show, runs 9-10 PM EST Wednesday evenings, on AM 1360, WNJC and is archived on www.whiterosesociety.org Or listen to it streaming, live at either www.wnjc1360.com or here.
A few declarations.
-While I'm registered as a Democrat, I consider myself to be a dynamic critic of the Democratic party, just as, well, not quite as much, but almost as much as I am a critic of republicans.
-My articles express my personal opinion, not the opinion of this website.
1) Conyers first point is irrelevant. The issue is one of law. If laws were broken, then this is the remedy within the law. Whether the people want it or not.
2) Conyers is SPOT ON, with this point. I know, I know, the majority of opednews readers think differently but the bottom line is the corporate media will spin this against the dems, 24-7 and NOT just Fox News. The only sane voice will be Olbermann. I did an article about just this fact and got roasted for it, but the truth is the truth.
3) There is enough time, not a legit reason.
4) I could care less if there are enough votes. The object is the truth, and then let our elected officials line up where they want, then their voters can decide what to do with those officials that put party over country.
5) Conyers is again, spot on. Right now, Obama crushes McCain. As long as the focus is on McCain's war stance and obscured econmic vision, Obama wins in a landslide. Start mucking everything up with impeachment, with the corporate media spin is begging to upset the applecart. Sure maybe it has no affect. But despite what progressives might iwsh and hope for, there is no way the impeachment hearings help Obama.
Peace.
by
Anthony Wade (145 articles, 2 quicklinks, 44 diaries, 509 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 11:26:14 AM
These listed reasons for not impeaching are just a smoke screen. The REAL reasons for not impeaching will never be acknowledged. They have to do with cowardice, and complicity.
It's easier to argue that if we can just hold on for another six months, that we will be rid of this plague. Unfortunately, a lot of damage can be wrought in that time.
by
Bill Cain (2 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 284 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 11:28:01 AM
"Conyers is not waffling about impeachment. He is being arm-twisted" commented a Congressional Aide at my local US Representative's office. That was important information. Thank you, Rob, for helping the cause along by posting Conyers's concerns and the contact info. I am going to fax my response below to Conyers, immediately. I urge others to PLEASE DO THE SAME. Life and death hinges around this, with martial law and a strike on Iran just around the corner. This is serious biz!
#1 The People won't want impeachment:
An MSNBC poll, as of last night (6-9-08) shows that 89% favor impeachment .That's in the mainstream cross-sector, not the liberal, conservative et al. It's just plain old MSNBC. Check it out for yourself and please also cast your vote, passing the link on to others:
That's probably true. But as the overwhelming public sentiment above becomes clear, that will change very fast. Corporate Media has everything to gain from public popularity. Plus, the public is increasingly tuning in to alternative news media instead of mainstream. Email gets around very fast. News will travel fast. Take heart, Mr Conyers.
3) Not enough time
NONSENSE! To let war crimes go unpunished, for a Prez to abandon Katrina victims to die, withhold healthcare from children while funding a war based on lies (ie, mass murder event), break more than 900 laws, wiretap without court warrant, "torture" (What a euphemism, better known as extreme violent criminality at best), and more....WITHOUT A SINGLE SLAP ON THE WRIST....is to invite more of the same from future Presidents.
Bring it on? No thank you, not on my tax dollars! GRRR! How can they even talk this way?
4) Not enough votes (in Congress)
I suspect that as the American pro-impeachment sentiment comes to more light, such as with the MSNBC poll, the votes in Congress will come around very fast.
That there is a lack of votes in Congress is absolutely true. The Constitution is burned to ashes and tossed in the air with shouts of glee.....not by Bush, not by Cheney, but by Congress themselves, who vote for the Red China-like legislation. Clearly they support Bush's power-grabbing. Clearly Congerss at large is deliberately working to convert the USA to a dictatorship. THROW THEM OUT, EVERY LAST ONE OF THE TRAITORS! Betraying the American people = treason. Get the guys out of there! They all need to be jailed.
REPEAT: COngress will come around for the sake of their selfish interests, when it becomes clear that the nation at large favors impeachment. The MSNBC poll is no small indication that this is exactly the case. 89% of the people!
5) Impeachment will likely cost Dems the election
Well this is the one which absolutely outrages me!! For the sake of their sacred little public image, life and death can go to hell, people can writhe on the ground with limbs blown off, FBI agents can unilaterally issue gag orders/subpoenas in secret based on their unilateral whims (Patriot Act), "torture" can invoke "pain levels equivalent to severe organ failure and death" (Military Commissions Act, torture bill), the Prez can be granted immunity from prosecution as a war criminal (Military Commissions Act/torture bill), we can go to war with Iran based on more lies (mass murder act), the world can die from global warming just so Bush can have his oil profits....all unchecked, just so they can "look good" and "Win". SELFISH BASTARDS! They need to have their heads examined by a highly qualified shrink! They are not mentally fit to be in public office, and I am NOT just saying that to be nasty! Think about it. I MEAN IT LITERALLY!!! THink about it again, folks. Please spread word. We've got to get these bastards out of office. It's no playing matter. Life and death hinge around this impeachment matter. And Congress has the BLOODY nerve to even talk about public image at a time like this? Oh my god.
Israeli radio has announced Bush's plans to strike Iran, indicating that this is for real and not some "Conspiracy theory" or the like. Wars based on lies=mass murder events. Period, end of discussion.
The lack of ethic is just appalling to me. It boggles my mind, actually, how people can be that unethical. Unbelievable.
Anyone who even talks this way, about preserving their self-image and their career when such violent/serious matters as above are at stake, is publicly confessing "anti-social personality disorder" in which murderers lack empathy and remorse for their victims. IE abnormal, criminal psychology.
GOT IT, MR CONYERS? GOT IT, CONGRESS AT LARGE?? I assure you, it is those of you who do *not* go ahead with impeachment who stand to lose your seat in public office. You may even find yourselves sitting in jail some day. DUH!!!!
by
Kathryn Smith (93 articles, 2 quicklinks, 38 diaries, 361 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 11:45:43 AM
We must have a two part response to the misadministration.
We must have impeachment to restore the Constitution and Bill of Rights and the fair application of the rule of law. That will go a long way to bring the country back from the abyss, and will show, internationally, that we follow our own protocols and rules for change. It will remove, if successful, the miscreants from power.
Secondly, we must have criminal trials and, if they are found guilty, appropriate punishment, to show the world we are making a comeback as a decent country.
So, for me, both impeachment and criminal trials. Only way to fly.
by
Jack Harrington (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 306 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 11:59:06 AM
Conyers reasons are the lamest excuses I have ever heard. Since when does Conyers speak for the American people? If an impeachment proceeding is begun the evidence will speak for itself. Who does Conyers think he is kidding? Both he and Pelosi do not want us anywhere near their table because we might want to look under it. The case is already building for Pelosi's dismissal and Conyers is right behind. An impeachment would require non-partisan cooperation and an excellant dose of true patriotism. I guess that would be asking too much of our Congressional "representatives, eh! As our voting public is beginning to awaken(finally) these miscreants will be paying for this at the polls. If nothing has been done by Novemeber we need to vote out every Congressional representative that has not voted to start the impeachment proceedings and particularly the Pelosi's and Conyers's that are blocking it.
by
Hayesml47 (4 articles, 0 quicklinks, 1 diaries, 461 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 11:47:31 AM
Digg this. Reddit it. Send it on to as many websites as you know of. Send the link by email to as many interested friends as you can, asking them to do the same. Write your editor. TIME TO GET WORD OUT LIKE NEVER BEFORE!!
This matter concerns....9-11 truth activists. Anti-war activists. Civil liberties activists. American freedom and free speech. Martial law. Global warming. 900+ broken laws. ANd MORE!
It's got to be THE most important piece of news....almost in the last seven years!
Please pass this on like your life depends on it! Because....it could!
Thank you, thank you, thank you!
by
Kathryn Smith (93 articles, 2 quicklinks, 38 diaries, 361 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 11:57:13 AM
Sorry for the spotlight, folks! I will sign off. Brief statement, very important:
THINGS HAVE CHANGED.
Given the MSNBC poll above, there will be....more support in Congress, even if only for the sake of preserving their seats in office. Increased news coverage, for the selfish sake of corporate gain. Underground news coverage and private e-mail chains a-plenty! Letters to the editor overflowing.
Public sentiment sets every ball rolling, because....Congress and Corporations (one and the same entity!) have everything to gain from popularity, and everything to lose from not catering to public sentiment.
End of discussion. End questions. End resistance. IMPEACH!
by
Kathryn Smith (93 articles, 2 quicklinks, 38 diaries, 361 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 12:00:43 PM
Just left my comment with the staffer at Conyers ofc in DC, she said now the Judiciary committee will review, they have these 5 reasons, blah, blah, i urged her to visit OpEdNews.com and look for this headlined article, 600K visitors a month and they should get on this sooner because they're gonna be getting calls; polls show 30% or more want them impeached now, and a solid majority want them impeached if they lied us into Iraq or broke the law spying w/o warrants- and this w/o any hearings yet. Thanked her for taking my call.
by
Better World Order (4 articles, 415 quicklinks, 27 diaries, 881 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 12:53:49 PM
The democrats except kucinich and a few others are without courage. Obama, Clinton and all the "mainstream" democrats are not patriots who believe in democracy and constitutional law. They are careerists and beauracrats, Obama is a professor of constitutional law. Where is his courage?. How does mr. "change" justify his silence? Nancy Pelosi says,"impeachment is off the table" Who does she represent? These cowards should all be impeached. They are only representatives of their own ambitions.
by
robert braunstein (26 articles, 0 quicklinks, 13 diaries, 93 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 12:56:39 PM
Cold cash Conyers says he has 5, I believe, reasons NOT to impeach. Dennis Kucinich listed 35 reasons on the House Floor TO impeach. 35 to 5, Impeachment clearly out weighs the not to's. I mean really, even if they can't stick Bush/Cheney for all 35, matter of probability will yield half or more that will, indeed, stick like glue.
They don't want to impeach. They like this Dictatorship we are in. Rich ppl do well --all around-- with Dictatorships.
Goodbye America, hello Ameri&co.
Most definitely these usurps and lawbreaking of Bush Adm. will roll that "toolbox" of new found ways to the next Prez. It will get worse and worse until MOST Americans are effected adversely by this dictatorship that has been installed. Possibly --maybe-- if the suffrage gets so bad amongst the majority of Americans, they will over throw the Government thugs, in total, and take back the country. However, with the wars, sky wars, and flooding from sea rise soon approaching, I think America will come to an end.
Conyers has this ONE window of opporunity to change this, and he makes excuses. I was told once, "an excuse is like an as*hole, everyone has one". In this case, they have five~~.
by
shirley reese (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 308 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 1:04:41 PM
Re: "People don't want it": If you start to realise your big brother is some sort of mass murderer or serial killer, you may not want to have to deal with that reality. However, just saying "I don't want this!" is not going to change anything, and until it is dealt with, many more will pay. It is not a question of "what people want", but one of law and consequences.
by
Aurora (0 articles, 1 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 345 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 2:35:44 PM
"Corp Media will slay us" - Huh? If you are intent on doing what is right and necessary, what is required by law, then any hypothesized response by the media or anyone else is utterly irrelevant. The only relevant question is, what needs to be done, - what is the right thing to do.
by
Aurora (0 articles, 1 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 345 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 2:53:20 PM
Congressman Conyers represents my district. He's been a good public servant, but I'm extremely disappointed in his inaction on impeaching the crooks who took control of our country. He seems to be playing games, toying with the public. Call me cynical, but this "Rebuke my reasons not to impeach" appears to me the latest one. I hope everyone who reads the opednews will call his office, and read him the riot act. Let him know to put up or shut up.
by
dglow (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 5 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 3:01:23 PM
"Not enough time". "Now" is what we have, and "Now" is all the time that is needed, to begin making things right. (To suggest otherwise is to procrastinate.)
by
Aurora (0 articles, 1 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 345 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 3:15:11 PM
To suggest that justice should not be implemented because it might cost votes in the election is a coldly cynical response, a corruption of justice. I cannot believe that such a "rebuttal" arose from John Conyers himself.
by
Aurora (0 articles, 1 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 345 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 4:09:35 PM
"If there ever was a great cause for impeachment, it would be 9/11"
May be Conyers should be told that Bush's refusal to launch an honest investigation into what really happenend in 9/11 is indeed a case for impeachment.
by
ramsheyi (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 452 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 4:23:07 PM
All of you have valid points. If we are going to impeach it needs to happen now before Bush gets those nuclear warheads to bomb Iran delivered to the arriginal destination, and FEMA opens all these martial law prisons
by
GUY P. FRASER (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 62 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 4:31:35 PM
Turley was on Randi Rhodes this afternoon and will be on Keith Olbermann's Countdown tonight on MSNBC, which is repeated twice after the 8 p.m. EST airing.
On Rhodes, he said one reason they won't impeach is because they'd almost have to impeach themselves, because many members of Congress knew what was going on with Bush's illegal programs.
Turley's or Rhodes' answer to that was the obvious: Fess up! Say they knew about the programs in general, but not the specifics, like holding children in prison.
True, the whole truth or half-truths...who knows, but it's plausible enough to get them off the hook of culpability and on with the impeachment.
by
Sandy Sand (140 articles, 0 quicklinks, 193 diaries, 1362 comments)
on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 at 5:22:27 PM
Last night on countdown Turley called it possible 'collusion' on the part of some democrats. Let's not forget that Pelosi, Reid, Boxer, and many others were briefed on warrentless wiretapping and extended interogation techniques but were obligated to keep their existence classified. Records of those briefings in some cases would likely show some opposition by democrats but probably a lot of enabling and collusion. For those democrats who knew of these illegal programs the only way to have kept themselves out of legal jeopardy would have been to blow the whistle. This would lead to there loosing there positions in congress and maybe even their freedom. However, as pointed out in the international treaties resulting from the Nuremberg trials, 'just following orders' is an unacceptable defense for breaking national and international law. Many members of the establishment DNC can not afford to have impeachment proceedings go into investigation for fear they themselves would face inditement and prosecution. But Denise is a smart guy; he knows that investigations will not be persued. But by getting a full house vote, we will have an immediate list of the enabling DNC members. With this list we can begin to purge the democratic party of ambisous career politicians. Let's think about a hypothetical situation...If you were standing in a group of your family members and there was suddenly a live grenade on the ground, what would you do? Jump on it? Knowing that it would kill you but save the lives of your family? Now what if you where Nancy Pelosi and Bush and his buddies told you in a classified security briefing that they were breaking the law to spy on Americans. Would you sacrifice your own political career and possibly your freedom to stop the illegal program? If you were Nancy, apparently not.
by
erik mouse (4 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 106 comments)
on Wednesday, June 11, 2008 at 8:24:04 AM
