Sociopaths like Bush, Hillary, and McCain use muscle, money, and fraud to gain position.  They are basically crooks.

by John Hanks (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 1762 comments [39 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Jul 22, 2008 at 10:26:17 AM

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What are we winning?  I keep hearing Senator McCain on TV today saying we come home when we win the war....what are we winning?  How does one know when one has won the war?   We have been training the Iraqi soldiers and police for so many years now and if they can't take over completly by now we have screwed up something royally along the way.

by shanti (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 43 comments) on Tuesday, Jul 22, 2008 at 11:34:57 AM

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Good observations, but what would you expect from the candidate selected by the establishment? The far right are not stupid people, they are clueless. What's happened though is that as clueless as they have demonstrated themselves to be, the American public fell for it hook, line and sinker. How else would "W" be our president. So, are they wrong in thinking that they can carry on with the same tactics that got bush in office and continue to suck in an obviously clueless nation? McCains handlers know what he is, they're aware that bush is a moron. What do they care? The people seem to  buy it, they voted for him. They realize that no matter what they do, whether initiate a coup when their candidate is losing, initiate a terrorist attack when they need to invade a country, alter the Constitution and throw a smokescreen over our rights and freedoms preparing themselves for the day when they'll need "laws" to subdue "mobs" of radicals,, no one will object. At least not enough to matter. So, they continue with the tactics that have been succesful in the past, secure in the knowledge that we are sheep and will do as we're told.

I submitted an article which placed in the diary section  http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/diarypage.php?did=8264 relating my opinions on the upcoming elections and the nations views on the candidates. The gist of the article was 'no matter the results of the election, be wary because the same people will still be in charge.'

My point is that the establishment has gained so much power with such outright impunity that they feel indefeatable. McCain is a perfect example of this attitude and few people other than yourself recognize that fact. Thank God that a forum like OEN is available for some of us to express our opinions of what is really going on in this country and it's not as simple as most people perceive.

If we allow the present government to continue as it has we will soon be the best Third World Nation in the world. Not enough people yet believe that is possible, just as Europe didn't believe that Hitler intended to annihilate the Jews and rule the world. If History hasn't taught us anything else it has taught us that we learn nothing from History. We have a long struggle ahead and an election is not going to solve our problems. Extreme vigilence and constant accountability to the people is the answer and we have to demand it, one way or the other.

by PeterJ (16 articles, 3 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 236 comments [53 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Jul 22, 2008 at 11:45:11 AM

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Try offering a fact to one of your dimwitted Republican Religious Right 'friends' and see what happens.  Facts ain't in it, whatever is their personal fantacy of how the world works, tempered by fairy tales from their religious leaders determines their belief system.  Even the POOR dimwits vote against their best interest, in the mistaken belief that one they they will be rich and not want to pay any of those nasty taxes either.

 Veteran '66-68

by Roger (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 465 comments [22 recommended, 1 rejected]) on Tuesday, Jul 22, 2008 at 12:05:34 PM

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It's the G.W. Bush modus operandi sans a pit bull Dick Cheney type to drive it through.

by Maxwell (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 409 comments [85 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Jul 22, 2008 at 12:35:05 PM

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Assuming Drudge Report didn't polish it up, it looks presentable enough (not that I agree with it). I've seen far worse writing on OEN, frankly. I've seen writing no better in the NYT. Most important, not publishing it is a lightning rod for media bias charges.  In this case the identity of the author should trump the highest degree of writing style.

by Maxwell (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 409 comments [85 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Jul 22, 2008 at 12:51:09 PM

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it is a content issue. Obama fully articulated his plans, see this and the Times determined that McCain had not done so.  Its one thing to draw contrasts with your opponent has Obama has done, it is another to attack your opponent without completely describing what is victory and how to get there.

by Steven Leser (255 articles, 58 quicklinks, 38 diaries, 2147 comments [63 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Tuesday, Jul 22, 2008 at 3:00:22 PM

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McCain's piece doesn't read like the screed Mr. Kall suggests it does. It is a factual, well-written article that deserves some space in the New York Times. Its only problem that I can see is that it is a bit too lengthy for a response, but I believe the NYT didn't leave it out because of its length but for its content, which is a shame.

It the McCain piece, he rightly points out that Mr. Obama refuses to acknowledge that he was wrong about the surge working, and he refuses to change his stance on a 16 month timetable for withdrawal as the facts on the ground in Iraq have changed. That is the crux of the McCain piece and it is essentially correct. He is right to challenge Obama's stance on both the success of the surge and whether to set an artificial timetable for withdrawal from Iraq.

I am neither a supporter of the war in Iraq nor of Senator McCain, but even I don't want us to throw away the improving facts on the ground by setting an artificial timetable for withdrawal no matter what Maliki says. That could lead to an explosion of internal violence within Iraq that the stabillizing force of the American presence is currently preventing. This is something that Obama fails to acknowledge, and it is to his detriment.

Obama should admit that the US military surge in Iraq has largely succeeded and should stop calling for a 16 month timetable for withdrawal due to improving facts on the ground. To do otherwise shows his intransigence in the face of a greatly improved situation, and it opens the possibility of his snatching defeat from the jaws of victory in Iraq, a war which I admit never should have been fought, but a war which should be won for the long term safety of the people of Iraq by preventing genocide.

If Obama were honest, he would admit that he was wrong about the surge and would have the guts to push back his timetable for withdrawal until the Iraqi army is strong enough to stand on it own two feet. However, being a politician often means never admitting you were wrong about anything, and in that sense Obama is acting like a typical politician instead of a man who is supposedly able to transcend politics. McCain has every right to point these facts out.

by Sam Adams (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 90 comments) on Tuesday, Jul 22, 2008 at 5:14:47 PM

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The surge was an abysmal failure. The Malaki government hasn't met even half of the goals that were set out as critical success factors that should be achieved by/during the surge.

No one doubts that if we throw enough troops at a situation that we can temporarily pacify a country or region. However, if there is no political solution, anytime the troops are withdrawn, the situation on the ground will eventually deteriorate.

McCain and any GOP supporters should admit that Bush, McCain and the rest of the GOP lied us into Iraq and should resign and stay away from public service.

by Steven Leser (255 articles, 58 quicklinks, 38 diaries, 2147 comments [63 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Tuesday, Jul 22, 2008 at 8:35:57 PM

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 At 71, McCain, doesen't have a clue nor any clear vision for this country.
 He lives, with his billionaire wife Cindy, in his own private Idaho.
 The truly scary part is that, this senior citizen, should be spending a little
 more time in the garden, instead of seeking Armegeddon in His lifetime.
 Clearly the flip side of the Bush coin. We lost 50,000 young men in Vietnam,
 due to the republican escalation of that conflict. We also left Vietnam in quite hurry,
 unable to save it from imminent Doom!
          Today Vietnam, is a wonderful tourist attraction, as a matter of fact, the Miss
 Universe Pageant was just held there! Imagine that! Miss Venezuela won.
 What is so sad and disturbing is that, Miss Venezuela would have won anyway
 without the 50,000 U.S Deaths and countless maimed.
           If you would like a similar experience, vote McCain.
 If you want an intelligent America, Vote for Obama.
         Obama has a vision to restore America's, inherent greatness. He has far more wisdom
 and far better Judgement than his opponent. Currently, America has gone off the rail
 on a crazy train. Its time to say NO to captain Ahab, who would like us all to join him
 on the crazy train, and more importantly catching the whale.
           Its so important to understand what these "Wide Stance" republicans are saying,
 so heres your handbook-->    http://www.squidoo.com/double_speak

 McCain thought Nixon was great!--cmon people!!!

by Lew Ranger (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 1 diaries, 48 comments) on Tuesday, Jul 22, 2008 at 7:15:46 PM

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If he wanted to attack Obama, McCain needed to provide his solutions. The media have repeatedly let McCain make broad general statements without any detail. In addition, the media did some easily research they would find the falsity for many of his statements.

CNN (Anderson Cooper) is attacking McCain's statement that Obama would lose a war to win the presidency. Blasting the media is another back fire for McCain.

The Jed Report put together a video history of McCain's contradictory statements about Iraq and supporting Bush's war efforts.  http://www.jedreport.com/2008/07/a-little-bit-ab.html

“My newest video features John McCain talking about the Iraq war from 2002 through the present, exposing -- in his own words -- the lie behind his claim that he was the war's "greatest critic." It demonstrates his chilling commitment to fighting this war no matter what the people of America -- or Iraq -- want.

It is long -- nine minutes, thirty seconds -- but much of the material it contains will likely be new to you...and devastating to McCain.

Using YouTube's annotations feature, I've added the dates for the post-war video clips, but in order to view them, you will have to watch the clip at YouTube itself as annotations are not currently supported in embeds.”

by Julie Johnson (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 30 comments) on Tuesday, Jul 22, 2008 at 9:29:53 PM

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I don't know how anyone can argue that the surge in Iraq has been a failure. By every objective measure it has been a resounding success. Internal violence is way down. Violence against US troops is way down. Al Qaeda in Iraq is virtually destroyed. Of course their hasn't yet been a political accommodation between the Sunnis and Shi'ites, but can one be expected while violence is still raging in the streets? No. Internal peace and stability must come first, then one can work on power sharing arrangements. The fact the surge is a success is a very inconvenient truth for Obama and his followers. McCain staked his whole campaign on the surge working to stem the violence. Now that it has, he has a right to take Obama to task for wanting to throw away those hard-fought gains by sticking to his timetable for withdrawal. I agree that the Iraq war never should have been fought. I believe the Bush administration lied us into that war and that McCain helped cover up that fact as part of the Robb-Silberman Commission that looked into the pre-war Iraqi WMD intel. However, the relevant question on the table is where do we go from here? Do we cut and run or see the war through to a successful conclusion? Do we throw away the gains of the surge and withdraw prematurely, or do we stay until the Iraqi police can control the streets and a political compromise has been reached? I'm not suggesting an obvious answer to what seem to be rhetorical questions. But I AM suggesting that the Obama campaign staked its success on the failure of the surge in Iraq. Now that it has succeeded, Obama can either try to deny the obvious as you have done or change his stance in accordance with the altered reality on the ground. So far Obama has shown no sign of admitting he was wrong about the surge. Expect McCain to keep calling him out on this issue. After all, no matter what you think of McCain personally, he staked his whole campaign on the success of the surge, and now that it has succeeded, he has a right to crow about it. And he will. This will be a thorn in Obama's side from now until the election unless the situation in Iraq takes a dramatic turn for the worse. It's time for Obama to come clean and admit his was wrong about the surge, take into account the improved situation on the ground and suspend indefinitely his call for a phased withdrawal from Iraq.

by Sam Adams (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 90 comments) on Wednesday, Jul 23, 2008 at 3:42:13 AM

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There were 18 specific benchmarks set out for Iraq war in general and the surge in particular. We have met three of them. http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/2008/01/benchmark.html

i.e., the surge is a failure. End of story.

by Steven Leser (255 articles, 58 quicklinks, 38 diaries, 2147 comments [63 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Wednesday, Jul 23, 2008 at 7:34:30 AM

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Right on!

He not only doesn't know what he's talking about he hasn't got a clue as to where the true problem lies. In your first response you hit it on the head in regards to the bush administration resignations except you didn't go far enough. Under the current circumstances they must be prosecuted as traitors to their nation, for Treason, War Crimes,  and Murder. They have overstepped far more than a few rules. In another country (or maybe here) in another time , they would have already been tried and executed.

by PeterJ (16 articles, 3 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 236 comments [53 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Wednesday, Jul 23, 2008 at 10:49:28 AM

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Here's the problem I have with this argument: If the surge was really such an unequivocal success, we should if anything be able to bring the troops home even sooner. The idea that we have to stay indefinitely win or lose is just plain crazy.

by Dolores Sailors (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 6 comments) on Wednesday, Jul 23, 2008 at 8:14:20 AM

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What good is success if nothing is achieved. So what, Al Quida is removed from one city, they're still just as strong as ever everywhere else. So what if we kick ass on some guy down the street who poses no threat to us while our own family is at home being robbed (of money, civil rights, freedom) by the very people who sent us down to kick his ass.

You fall right into the same trap as everyone else who ever listened to one word from the bush administration and took it as valid substance.

Wake up before it's far too late. Why are people who are so obviously wrong always so impossibly stubborn?

by PeterJ (16 articles, 3 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 236 comments [53 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Wednesday, Jul 23, 2008 at 8:46:58 AM

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try it. Your writing will be better for it.

by Steven Leser (255 articles, 58 quicklinks, 38 diaries, 2147 comments [63 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Wednesday, Jul 23, 2008 at 7:26:45 AM

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Whatever your objective you're wasting your time and probably confusing most of the clueless idiots out there who voted for bush in the first place.

Of course you're not McCain, you're obviously much more intelligent. So, who are you and what are you trying to prove? Do you hate McCain and think that people believe you and will get angry at him? It's hard to tell but you are funny. We do need some smiles these days.

Try being Obama and see how it goes. Better still, be George Bush, you spell like him.

by PeterJ (16 articles, 3 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 236 comments [53 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Wednesday, Jul 23, 2008 at 8:55:31 AM

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“Iraq has met all but three of 18 original benchmarks set by Congress last year to measure security, political and economic progress.”

So says the US Embassy in Baghdad as referenced in the McCain rebuttle that was rejected by the New York Times.

How does all but three of 18 benchmarks equal three? Sounds more like 15 to me. So who are the real clueless people around here? Those who for political reasons refuse to acknowledge that the surge in fact worked, something that even I admit I never expected. But is has, end of story.

And Barack Obama is as loath to accept that truth as his political followers on the left since it is indeed An Inconvenient Truth, to borrow a phrase from Al Gore.

No, the success of the surge doesn't mean it's time to cut and run. Not until all 18 benchmarks have been reached and there is real political accommodation and power sharing between Sunnis and Shi'ites and the Iraqi military is capable of keeping the peace on its own. Otherwise, chaos and genocide are the likely outcomes of a too hasty withdrawal.

The success of the surge is a truth that the left can't handle. YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH because it doesn't fit neatly into your political framework. Deal with it, because the truth and Senator McCain aren't going away.

We'll see if Senator Obama can handle that truth better than you have. So far he hasn't. He can't admit he was wrong. He can't bring himself to back away from his 16 month withdrawal plan. He'd rather save face than save Iraq. He'd rather win an election than win a war.

by Sam Adams (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 90 comments) on Thursday, Jul 24, 2008 at 4:51:00 AM

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Steven Leser's link was dated Jan. 24, 2008.

A lot has changed since then. 

by Sam Adams (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 90 comments) on Thursday, Jul 24, 2008 at 5:12:44 AM

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The first justification for the then future SURGE was to provide "space" for the Iraqi govenment to reach accomodation with the rest of the various political factions. That has not happened and in the near future will not happen. The SURGE has not succeeded. Ipso, etc.

As for the NYT editorial decision: Yes, an editor's duty is to make sure t's are dotted and i's are crossed, series are separated by commas or semi-colons, premises are supported by arguments, etc. But, one of the gravest duties of any editor is to try to prevent her writer from making an idiot of himself.  Even though that might be, in Sen. McCain's case, impossible, she must still try. McCain's weakness in this case is his repetitive failure to offer any substantiation (reality based) for his protestations against Obama's stance. In fact, the editors may have been aware (believe it!) of the developing  scenario involving the Iraqi prime minister's support for Obama's anti-McCain position. Hmm. Would a responsible editor offer McCain the opportunity to modify his claims? Update his position? Of course. Because McCain was looking more and more out of touch, out of date with the ebb and flow of world positions, and more unsupportable. If Mr. DON'T TAMPER WITH MY PROSE didn't take the suble hint that the NYT was trying to help him not make a fool of himself, well...Of course, his neo-con staff is going to try to run from the conversation, ignore reality, shift the focus and blame the Times. That's all they've got. The str8 tawk xpress is running on fumes.

by GalapagoLarry (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 2 comments) on Saturday, Jul 26, 2008 at 5:47:33 PM

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