It was clear from that start that the Palin pick was just a political ploy.

The bailout is over my head.

by Michael Dewey (5 articles, 1 quicklinks, 4 diaries, 245 comments [12 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 9:32:15 AM

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It is no accident that we're going through.

It is a fact that America's average IQ has dropped 30 points in the past 40 years, which correlates with when our government added the poison Sodium Fluoride into our water system and the systematic dismantling of our education system.

This may well explain why we have a populace that excepts a two-party system the does not represent them and can be easily manipulated by a corporate controlled media.

Yet even with a lowered IQ most of the public can still grasp that they're being screwed, and that too can be manipulated by powers above both false political parties for the benefit of Power Elites that own not only this country, but through their control of money markets throughout the world own political parties in most of the countries that matter along with their false political parties.

Case in point; both candidates supported this foolish so-called "recovery bill" against the wishes of 90% of the people, this by itself is enough to prove that as a concern, we, the people, simply don't matter, but this is not the point. As mentioned "nothing in politics happens by accident".

Being both parties are indeed owned by the same entities, why than should it matter which one gets to symbolize the false representation of a populace that itself doesn't matter?

Control by demoralization.

Obama at the beginning of his campaign was cleverly represented as the one that would end the war in Iraq, not unlike those that had this issue as their central theme, but unlike them, as time passed, so did Obama's position on ending the war in Iraq and instead promoted shifting it to Afghanistan and other countries to prolong this made-up "war on terror", completely by-passing the fact that it's all a lie. But I digress. Since Obama captured the nomination his immediate turn to the right angered and dismayed many progressives that were gathering like a tidal-wave behind him, his support of FISA was the start and every position since has been to abandon what gave him that momentum and nomination to begin with.

The manipulators say this was because he had to "shift to the middle" to win in a general election, which of course defies logic since what he was doing with his original message was waking-up the enormous sleeping giant of those 50% of voters that had given-up on our corrupt system long ago. So just what was this purpose?

To put that sleeping giant back to sleep. Once capturing the nomination there was no need to awaken people, indeed, it's not to the Power Elites advantage to awaken anyone, but to keep them disillusioned and disenfranchised. This is Obama's real purpose.

It's obvious that Power Elites will have a better chance of continuing their goal of a One World Government by using the completely dumbed-down McCain supporters and having him in office, again, not that it really matters, being both drink from the same well, but by further disillusioning the general public and disengaging them from the political process it makes it easier for Power Elites to foster their plan. The last thing they want is for us to see through the matrix.

With this latest treasonous act and in your face support of this massive give away of our money to private interests, which will do nothing but make a coming depression even worse for us and better for the World Bankers/Power Elites, it was for many of Obama supporters the last straw and they are abandoning him and go Independent and given the fragmented field among those choices they present no fear to the Power Elites. But what it will do is syphon more votes away from Obama and make a plausible election of McCain possible with the aid of our corrupt voting system.

In a sum, it's a set-up. Raise hopes, smash them, instill those that will best follow orders.

We're being played in a grand game by Power Elites that have been gaming this system long before any of us were alive and they're doing a damn good job of completing their plan to destroy this country, as they are others, as we witness a world-wide collapse of financial institutions as the 13 original international banks rake-in the bulk of the riches and instill their "shock & awe" policies so very well described by Naomi Klein in her book Shock Doctrine.

So what are our choices? What can we do to throw a wrench in the Power Elites plans?

Unfortunately not much. Our time is short, we lack organization or the means to have a cohesive message portrayed. This is where a lot of "ifs" come into play.

If indeed the "sleeping giant" can get behind one independent candidate and if we can over come our corrupted voting system we could have a chance.

There is also the if enough people simply stopped complying with this corrupt system by refusing to pay taxes, making our own money system, refusing military service and for those in the military refusing to obey dishonorable orders, and pulling our money and support away from all those institutions that prop-up the Power Elites phony system we could than start from scratch by using the precepts of our Constitution as it should be used.

The question is have we enough intelligence left to do this, or has our collective IQ been damage and our disillusionment gone to far to do these things? And do we have the courage to admit that we've been gamed?

by Mr M (8 articles, 0 quicklinks, 66 diaries, 2845 comments [654 recommended, 27 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 10:29:05 AM

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Control by demoralization.  That's it.

We have become a nation of frightened little beings. We are worse than a 5 year old at a elementary school Haunted House.

 When did it become so outrageous to be outraged? I am totally baffled by the media's attempt to guide this election (which went on entrirely way too long) toward selfish ratings instead of truthful journalism?

Corporate America has a stake in all of this far bigger than I could ever imagine.  We have been watching "Wag the Dog" or almost eight years now, and nobody of mainstream media has the courage to step up to the truth plate?

A big bowl of goo is what we are suppose to swallow these days? We are told it tastes good, but at least some of us knows it's rancid.

Keep 'em coming Mr. Kall... 

by Steph Fauxco (6 articles, 0 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 72 comments [3 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 11:17:24 AM

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... because they aren't a media at all, but propaganda arm of Power Elites that own all of them just like they own the two parties. There are only two main sources from which all media networks get their information, Reuters and Associated Press, both own by extension the Rothschild family.

It's why with all the obvious evidence that 9/11 was an inside job instead of having so-called investigative journalists doing their job, they instead ridicule those that point that fact out.

In order for us to change the landscape we have to fundamentally change our habits, one of which is by throwing away your TV and ignoring major print media. It's not there to inform but to distort.

by Mr M (8 articles, 0 quicklinks, 66 diaries, 2845 comments [654 recommended, 27 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 11:58:47 AM

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You might be interested in this clip of Larry McDonald on Crossfire discussing the NWO 15 years ago, back in the day when it could be discussed.  Shortly therafter Larry was killed on that KAL 007 crash(shoot down).  Larry exposed the massive aid and trade of the US with the Soviet Union back in the day when they were the enemy (today replaced by the terrorists) .

http://vodpod.com/watch/532734-larry-mcdonald-on-the-new-world-order

Anyways, whats going down is way too advanced to even think of change.  If change comes, it will come from the top, not from the brain dead entertainment addicted fat lazy bottom or middle.

by pft (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 601 comments [7 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 6:28:44 PM

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and it was still much how people try to dismiss those same organizations today, which of course is all part of the plan.

It's not like Obama or McCain would come out and admit the influence various committees and groups do have or their relationship to them. that would take away from their aurora, after all, why vote for someone if you know they're simply a sock-puppet?

by Mr M (8 articles, 0 quicklinks, 66 diaries, 2845 comments [654 recommended, 27 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 10:04:03 PM

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I can always rely on you to be the lone seer of the truth Mr. M.

No one dares allude to "One World Order".  Everyone treats it like the "Cancer" word, ignore it and it will go away. Even as we make giant strides to becomming just like the rest of the world. Not neccesarily like countries we should emulate either, we want to be like China , Russia, anyplace which is or compromises communism.

I don't believe that people in this country will wake up to the fact that Obama's just like McCain until they're changing the flag and shutting down websites.

Good luck people, you're all in for the surprise of your lives.

by PeterJ (16 articles, 3 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 236 comments [53 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 4:30:05 PM

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It's extremely hard for people to believe that their status-quo is threatened. No one wants to believe their job won't be there, food won't be on the shelf, gas won't be in their tank.

And indeed to maintain some sense of equilibrium, and never having known true deprivation, most don't have any sense of what living under true hardship is like, especially pseudo-intellectuals of the kind found in blogs like this.

To speak of Illuminati, NWO, and their off-shoots also gives a sense that there's a lack of control over what one could do. After all it's a scary thing to realize there are enormous forces of evil intent working to enslave you and worse.

But to not talk about them surely condemns one to become their victim. So the only thing we can do is to keep bringing it up.

"In the bringing a patriot is a man to be feared and shunned, but as time proves him right and risk becomes less he is joined by weaker men."

by Mr M (8 articles, 0 quicklinks, 66 diaries, 2845 comments [654 recommended, 27 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 9:33:06 PM

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where is the information that sodium flouride in the water is responsible for the decline of mental intelligence?  i am not questioning that information, just wanting a resource for it.....

by tanya (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 37 comments) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 8:15:59 AM

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that the choice of Palin was stupid political bullshit that wont work. That was, of course, when she thought the mike was off.

by Steven Leser (255 articles, 58 quicklinks, 38 diaries, 2147 comments [63 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 11:35:15 AM

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Bush Sr. used the same tactic in picking Dan Quayle to insulate himself from impeachment should a Democratic House investigate his role in the Iran/Contra affair.  His cynical and dangerous choice for a running mate while riding on Reagan's coattails into the Oval Office should have alerted the MSM and all of America that the Bushes had no great loyalty to the welfare of the American people. 

by W.M.L. (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 537 comments [52 recommended, 1 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 1:03:27 PM

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Insulating yourself from impeachment by choosing a VP that is an idiot makes a lot of sense from a political/criminal perspective.

Choosing an idiot for VP when you are 72 with a history of cancer is a whole different matter.

by Charlie L (2 articles, 4 quicklinks, 1 diaries, 747 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 1:28:59 PM

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There's a long conservative trail of valuing deception.  Iraq war, etc.   There's the whole lie and deception of conservative values and family values, which is really just   self-righteousness and hypocrisy. Self-righteousness is a form of lying and deception.

by Edwin Rutsch (64 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 155 comments) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 2:04:14 PM

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I bet you could never find more than the two examples you've provided of DEMOCRATS doing exactly what you accuse conservatives of, huh?

by UncleSim (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 512 comments [74 recommended, 3 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 7:18:08 PM

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Traiters and cowards fits the Bush Administration, and a sizable % of the Democrats. A massive fraud has been done to the American people, and the world at large.

Integrity and Morarilty have no part in the traiters lives.  At least you would believe that they would support America but no such luck.

Let the people punish all those who did not support their constituants.

by Rolland Miller (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 227 comments [78 recommended, 1 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 2:12:28 PM

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We are experiencing the final fall of America, that is unless the people themselves develop some sort of backbone.  We have witnessed 8 yrs. of citizen degradation by an idiotic syncophant and his cronies.  We have witnessed the almost total destruction of the Constitution and all of our rights, yet damn few have fought against it.  We have witnessed our military being used as a bludgeon against a country that had NO involvement in 9/11.  Our elections have been stolen, turned into the laughing stock of the world, yet Bush and Co. insist that others live by our rules.  Well, just maybe they are.

Now we have a bunch of spineless legislators allowing themselves to be stampeded by the wild threats of Bush and Co.  Now we have a man (McCain) who is becoming more erratic every day. We have a Sarah Palin who is so far out of touch with reality, that she thinks she is capable of running this nation.  We are seeing those who are supposed to act in our best interest, sit and watch while Bush and Co. play the violin while America burns.

 All of them belong in either in depth psychiatic therapy or behind bars. If any of us betrayed our country, the trust of the people this way; we would be in jail or probably in front of a firing squad at the orders of "His supreme majesty - Geo. Bush", with the order co-signed by McCain, Palin and many others.

 Where do we go from here now?  We are already in that handbasket on the doorstep of Hell.

by Wazi (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 6 comments) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 2:41:13 PM

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but I don't have a clue why you let neo-liberal Democrats off the hook. They've been enablers and co-conspirators all along.

It isn't really a partisan issue at all.  Americans have been seduced and abandoned by their own greed and voluntary blindness to the exploitations that fed our prosperity.

We are getting just what we deserve.

by Laudyms (0 articles, 1142 quicklinks, 10 diaries, 708 comments [138 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 2:58:57 PM

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As the stock market continues to free fall, despite the 800 billion dollar bailout, losses will go up in retirement funds. Already the AP report $2 trillion in losses. "Public and private pension funds and employees' private retirement savings accounts " like 401(k)'s " have lost some 20 percent overall since mid-2007." http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27073061/

by Matoska (22 articles, 1 quicklinks, 1 diaries, 33 comments) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 4:17:46 PM

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Rob Kall writes:

What kind of person sells out his or her country for gain? Most would call them traitors.

What kind of person lies and distorts for gain. Most would call them liars. 

I agree with both statements.

In two years, when it it is likely that it will become clear that the Democratic leadership made a massive error in supporting the $700 billion bailout and, probably more bailouts to follow, the lying traitors may start looking pretty good in comparison to the economic cowards who obeyed Bush and Paulson and ignored their constituents. 

That's where you lose me. In order to obey Bush and Paulson, the Democrats also had to lie and sell out their country for gain. 

As Mr. M. wrote:

Case in point; both candidates supported this foolish so-called "recovery bill" against the wishes of 90% of the people....

The selection of Palin, however treacherous, had nothing to do with the bailout as far as I can see. I believe that the bipartisan Congressional leadership would still have continued to serve the wealthy elites who run this country, no matter who the candidates were. I certainly don't see how McCain's choice of Palin frightened the Democrats into supporting the bailout. They certainly knew from the unprecedented feedback they got from constituents, that it wouldn't get them more votes.

Since it was the Democrats who took the lead in supporting the bailout, I don't see that it was their cowardice that led them to become lying traitors to the American people, but rather their avarice. 

But in addition to being traitors like the Republicans, the Democrats obviously are also cowards because rather than supporting Bush the way they always do, they could have simply begun impeachment proceedings. On the other hand, that would have required more than mere courage -- it would have required that they actually opposed Bush, Paulson, and the bailout, which they did not, do not, and never will. It would have required that they put the interests of their constituents before their own interests as members of the powerful wealthy elite, which they did not, do not, and never will. It would have required that in addition to not being economic cowards, that they were also not lying traitors.

In propping up a Ponzi scheme that they made possible through deregulation, both parties are lying traitors and economic cowards, in my humble opinion.

Also, in my humble opinion, it is only the fact that many Americans still view politics as a talent show or beauty contest, that led McCain to choose Palin and leads many people to think of Obama and Biden as the lesser evils, rather than any substantial and meaningful differences in their actions with regard to war, the economy, or the role of government in a democratic system.

by Mark E. Smith (21 articles, 30 quicklinks, 100 diaries, 1325 comments) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 5:42:34 PM

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But why do you blame deregulation?

Sarbanes-Oxley is probably the best example of extreme regulations not only failing to accomplish their intended purpose, but of actually making things worse.

Did such regulation keep the likes of Enron from breaking the law?  Did a lack of regulation keep the investors in the stock market from destroying the value of overrated stocks like Enron before the rest of the country knew there was even a problem?

It would seem like the market is the fastest and most efficient indicator of a company's failures, unless interfered with by fascists or progressives with printing presses, or proposals for new government programs to burden future generations with problems.

As if we don't have enough problems without oppressive, inefficient, government programs with nice names and evil intentions.

by UncleSim (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 512 comments [74 recommended, 3 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 7:32:47 PM

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Uncle Sim writes:

But why do you blame deregulation?

You're right, Uncle Sim. Neither deregulation nor regulations, when imposed by an undemocratic government that believes its job is to do what it thinks best rather than to represent the will of the people, are likely to be of much use to us. 

Many people are outraged because they feel betrayed by their representatives. They really and truly believed in their hearts that they were voting for people to represent them, not giving their consent to people to rule over them. Congress, of course, as Kurt Belleman explained in The Prevailing Theory and accompanying links, doesn't see things that way at all. They believe that by voting, we are granting them our consent to rule over us. 

Those who still believe that they are supposed to represent us rather than rule over us, also feel outrage when they find that we have no nonviolent Constitutional way to hold them accountable and force them to represent us during their terms in office, which is when they are part of government and can do us irreparable damage. All we can do is vote in the next election in hopes of electing somebody who will actually represent us, and we are shocked, shocked I tell you, every time, when the new government officials take our votes as being our consent to allow them to rule over us, rather than as our intention that they represent us.

And so it goes.....   ;)

by Mark E. Smith (21 articles, 30 quicklinks, 100 diaries, 1325 comments) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 8:09:48 PM

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You wrote: "Since it was the Democrats who took the lead in supporting the bailout, I don't see that it was their cowardice that led them to become lying traitors to the American people, but rather their avarice. "

What do you base the accusation of avarice upon?

by Rob Kall (952 articles, 4177 quicklinks, 374 diaries, 2087 comments [45 recommended, 3 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 10:00:50 PM

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Rob asks:

What do you base the accusation of avarice upon?

All members of Congress are millionaires and billionaires. That makes them "Wall Street" rather than "Main Street." 

So when they act to give preference to Wall Street over Main Street, they are acting in their own best interests and that of their class, not our interests or the interests of more than 90% of their constituents.

The rich are different from you and I, Rob. For one thing, they're rich. 

Had they used that $850 billion to help the homeless, the jobless, and those without health care, the derivatives market might have collapsed and their investment portfolios would have been worth pennies on the dollar. But a lot more Americans would have homes, jobs, and health care. They helped the greedy instead of the needy and since the greedy includes their wealthy selves, I call that avarice.

Sometimes I daydream conspiracy theories. Here's one for ya. Imagine that some corrupt rulers were intent upon looting the treasury of some banana republic. But the people of that country didn't much care for any of them, including their leader. So what they do is protect their leader from impeachment (as a reward for the fact that every year he had been in power, the defense stocks in their investment portfolios have doubled and tripled in value) and help him pull off some more huge treasury heists before there can be a revolution. Or is it just a coincidence that the same people doing the most to protect him from impeachment are the ones who led the push for the bailout? 

When Al Gore said that he was helping smooth Bush's transition to power in 2000 "for the good of the country," Rob, you probably believed that he meant in order to avert a revolution, not that he actually equated the wealthy ruling elites like himself with "the country," even if Lieberman was his running mate.

And in 2004, when John Kerry broke his promises to his constituents and said that he was also conceding to Bush "for the good of the country," I guess you hadn't noticed by then that the first four years of Bush had been good for wealthy elites like Kerry, but not for the country.

And now that the agenda of the money party (both branches, Democrats and Republicans) have wrecked our economy and embroiled us in unwinnable wars of aggression, you're still making excuses for them. It couldn't possibly be that they are screwing us for their own benefit. They're being forced to prop up their investment portfolios at our expense against their will because they're cowards, not because they're greedy, right? And the Democrats defied the House Republicans and 90% of the country when they voted for the bailout because they're cowards? Bravest darned cowards I've ever seen, Rob.  ;)

But let's suppose that you're right and that they aren't greedy, just cowards. Would giving more power to cowards who always, our of fear, cave in to Wall Street, the neo-cons, and the warhawks, be the best way to change the direction of the country? 

If Churchill was right and the only thing necessary for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing, then I'd say that you can always count on cowards to do nothing, so evil will continue to prevail if people are given power to reward them for cowardice. Cowardice isn't the lesser evil, it is the enabler of evil, without which evil could not prevail. And if I were a Democratic Party advisor or consultant, I'd try to think of a better selling point than cowardice. But there may not be any, so I guess that's the best that they can say for themselves.

by Mark E. Smith (21 articles, 30 quicklinks, 100 diaries, 1325 comments) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 12:26:22 AM

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i think its time to march on the capital---or do we sit and let it happen--come on rob---call to march---

by TRADESMAN (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 12 diaries, 335 comments [40 recommended, 1 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 6:40:04 PM

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It is the epitome of our American brand of Hubris to think we're special in some way, or to harbor fantasies of our "showing the world the road to democracy".  Really...I'm sick of it!

Yeah, these People's Representatives are treasonous lying traitors and worse.  But "the people" are the one's who are and have let them commit their heinous acts with impunity. WTF!  America...the Brave, the Honorable, the Disillusioned?!  Well, the Matrix of the elites doesn't have to suck in everybody -- only the suckers. 

Mr. Smith advocates no votes to delegitimize.  There  may be some truth to that.  Voting 3rd party also sends a message.  Choosing a lesser or greater evil means I'm stupid enough to (continue to) play their game in their venue -- not gonna do it.  The "kow-towing" to pressure, bribes, and all the other dehumanizing crap represented by our representatives is reprehensible.  Screw em!  They're parasites and players in this reeking corrupt system and they've attached themselves to it in a BIG way by giving away OUR Taxpayer dollars Without Our sanction.  ENOUGH.

Bailing out Collectively on Government Against the People, by joining Cooperatively Joining As the People is the only solution.  We are a Union, and we Do have power.  Huge Power.  We just forgot as Americans -- How to Use It!  The examples are there in history -- that's why our forefathers had a TEA Party.  That's why downtrodden workers organized Unions.  That's why pioneers circled the wagons, and WHY WE MUST PRESENT AN ORGANIZED FRONT.  Passively or very aggressively.  Do IT!

by boomerang (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 556 comments [215 recommended, 1 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 6:52:15 PM

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Boomerang writes:

Voting 3rd party also sends a message.

It does, but if you check out the reply I just posted to Uncle Sim above, you'll see why the message that is received may not be the message that you intended to send. 

Do you remember the little kids' party game of "Telephone," where everyone sits in a line and passes along a whispered message? Invariably, by the time the message gets to the end of the line, it no longer resembles the original message in any way. You might think of our electoral system as a sophisticated game of Telephone.  ;)

by Mark E. Smith (21 articles, 30 quicklinks, 100 diaries, 1325 comments) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 8:16:34 PM

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Good thing Demorats like Obama would never sell out their country for personal gain by suing banks to make more of the sub-prime loans that have snowballed into the economy killer they now claim to save us from.

Haven't the Democrats in Congress gone along with all the heinous Bush admin proposals just like the former Repugnant majority did?

I am simply amazed, that after being f*cked so hard by both sides, you still seem to love one side and hate the other.  Did they give you a reacharound or something?  Buy advertising on your site, maybe?

Me?  I hate both sides enough to reject both.  Both sides have, in the past, claimed to be the savior from the other sides' evil proposals, yet we still have oppressive government, ever-willing to tax us, steal from us, enslave us, and imprison us.  Which side has saved us, then?  And from what?

by UncleSim (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 512 comments [74 recommended, 3 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 7:09:57 PM

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When the rules are abandoned or not enforced those who break the rules out-compete those who follow the rules. 

In such a situation only the cheats survive. 

Fanny Mae and Freddie Mac were backed by an implied government guarantee this put them in a privileged position with respect to capitalization allowing them to out-compete their competition (With performance bonuses of course). 

When regulators attempted to reign them in they simply funded deregulatory legislators. 

by kwalsh (4 articles, 0 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 275 comments [10 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 8:30:43 PM

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When I was mayor of my city it was pointed out by a Pentecostal councillor that as city leaders we were raised up by God and ought to be obeyed.

I don't think that people with strong religeous beliefs are liars. 

I just think that occasionally they allow themselves to be manipulated into being unthinking rent-a-crowds for dubious causes. 

It is not inconcievable to me that pastors could receive donations from wealthy individuals say connected to the oil industry who might see potential gain from a promoting pastors with a biblically based climate change denial position.

by kwalsh (4 articles, 0 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 275 comments [10 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 8:56:21 PM

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They are all guilty of the same things.  Think about it... If McCain-Palin are so terrible - so OBVIOUSLY terrible - then how come Obama can only pull a few points ahead?  Because he is just as worthless as they are!  He's just worthless in different ways. 

I figure there are several million people more qualified to be president than either one of these guys...

It's not that Americans who support Obama are stupid and it's not that Americans who support McCain are stupid or ignorant -- it's just that we have 2 choices and neither of them are worth a damn!  It's just that one or the other of them fits closer to our views than the other.

We need to vote out all incumbents -- mine and yours!  (Regardless of your political affiliation, you had better get ready for TEOTWAWKI.)

And honestly, most of the politicians in office now should probably be in jail - dems and repubs...

by Armon Pacetti (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 21 comments) on Tuesday, Oct 7, 2008 at 9:31:06 PM

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Great post you submitted and I totally agree, "Nothing by chance". This gov't fall was planned way back in the 1850's. The Rothschilds family and their offspring and inlaws planned this for over 150 yrs. The Freemasons were a part of that plan. All worship Satan and all worship money. Their goals have almost been met. They set out to control the worlds money, have a military presence and control over all the countries(almost there) and destroy American Democracy--did and done.

But do we give up and just roll over? Do we vote a third party and allow the worse of the evil to prevail? I just think plugging your nose and voting for Obama at least will give us some better Justices. Can you imagine what it feels like to be a woman and chance my choices with Palin? My god, how can I dare accept no choice? Therefore, Obama may be a sell out, but he isn't quite the prejudiced, biased, crony a*s as McCain and Palin.

I still don't know who to vote for, Nader verses Obama. My conscience says Nader, but my female choice says Obama has the better chance. I would love Nader to get it. He has more experience than McCain and Obama put together and it isn't inside the beltway experience. He is strong and bright but he wouldn't win now would he? Do you think those repubs will really sway their party line? Undoubtedly, they will vote their party. The most of them always do.

It feels like hell here. (Repubs) Caging our votes in MT. I guess you don't really understand the plight that those Floridians went through or the Ohio ppl et al., till you are actually going through the same. It feels like 'hell' but the 'hand basket' is owned by China and man, that is the scary part. What do we do when China comes knocking for their money? They grab our land and water and resources and we hand them our hands so they can extract our finger nails from our fingers? We could only hope that Russia gets piss*d off at us and throws us some bombs...we could only hope. Sure beats the heck out of what China will do to us.

Good article Rob but it brought the darkest thoughts out of many of us. I'm trying to gear myself up, to giving all that I have up. I don't have much in the goods dept but giving the little I have all up and running to the caves and making myself free from the "corporate King" seems refreshing.

Good luck to all us, my fellow slaves of the 'corporate King'.

by shirley reese (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 592 comments [98 recommended, 1 rejected]) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 12:43:43 AM

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Shirley Reese writes:

But do we give up and just roll over? Do we vote a third party and allow the worse of the evil to prevail? I just think plugging your nose and voting for Obama at least will give us some better Justices. Can you imagine what it feels like to be a woman and chance my choices with Palin? My god, how can I dare accept no choice? Therefore, Obama may be a sell out, but he isn't quite the prejudiced, biased, crony a*s as McCain and Palin.

What I really don't understand, Shirley, is why anyone would think that we have a democratic government when decisions about things like your stated concerns are made by people who are appointed rather than elected. As I understand it, your question boils down to, "Who should I vote for in the rigged election where my vote probably doesn't count anyway, who might be more likely to appoint somebody who I have absolutely no say in choosing, to make dictatorial and unappealable decisions I will have to obey? Since nobody who might represent me has a chance of winning, aren't I better off voting for the coward instead of the traitor, or should I cast a protest vote that won't be counted?"

That really is a dilemma. Personally, I solved it for myself by not voting. But some people seem to enjoy having people they can't select, and over whom they have no control, make decisions they cannot appeal. Probably just a matter of individual preference.  ;)

by Mark E. Smith (21 articles, 30 quicklinks, 100 diaries, 1325 comments) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 2:12:53 AM

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Free market, global capitalists have no allegiance to any nation.  They are loyal to money and they have been tremendously successful in using their influence with the commercial media and with their well paid congressional lackeys and their army of lobbyists to convince the moronic American public that when 1% of the population has all the cash, it is better for everyone.

In 1960 there was a tax rate of %75 for upper income earners.  That top rate is down to %32 now for the few of them that haven't found some off-shore tax shelter or other loophole that allows them to pay nothing on their millions. They want us to pay for their wars of adventure with the dollars that we can't hide on our pay checks and with the blood of our children who are always asked to make the ultimate sacrifice.  These are the traitors.  This is the wealthy elite that would sell us out for gold or oil or whatever commoditiy is hot on the world markets.  These are the AIG jerks that, when given a public bailout for their company, take a 400,000 dollar junket to California to celebrate their good fortune.  There ought to be a gallows ready to go for those who would insult us and stab us in the back and then hope that we'll put their paid-for friend in the White House. 

by Bryan Emmel (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 415 comments [32 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 2:11:23 AM

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One of them is Kucinich. If you are following what he is writing and saying these days, it is clear that not all those in Congress are millionaires and billionaires. He lives what he talks about and is more in touch than any of these guys who stand in front of us with all the money left in the world betting on them. This is truly casino socialism as he says and while some continue to write him off as being either too hyperbolic or not in touch, I disagree. Yet, his push for impeachment was on target and had it taken traction, this situation might have been handled much differently. Had the bill he and Conyers introduced on universal health care been given a chance, that too might not be something we are going to now see tumble into chaos. If we cannot pay our mortgages, or credit cards, how do we pay the co-payments? Just starting from that thought ought to make us need to breathe deeply. Most people cannot fill the tank of their cars and just put in $20 and that is all they can do. The domino effect of the fraud perpetrated on us will not end for a good long time. There is plenty of criminality to pass around but had the impeachment process been allowed to happen, this mess would be focused in a much different way--towards the citizens who need help not towards the corporate giants who are still playing while we scrape by.

Good article Rob. This needs to be said though in the context of the failed impeachment drive. 

by Deborah Emin (26 articles, 1 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 95 comments) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 5:52:59 AM

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The sad thing is, practically everyone I know supported Kucinich, yet he was one of the first to be forced out. I was in tears watching him on the House floor fighting desperately for US, the American people, and against the Bail Out. This is the man who SHOULD be president!

by Kathleen Opon (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 2 comments) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 9:14:02 AM

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Destabilizing the economic masters can be done by exchanging fiat paper money for gold, silver, and items that have tangible value.  Those who hold their personal wealth in tangible form will see it skyrocket in value as the Fed Reserve printing presses scream into the night, shooting out a never-ending stream of virtual money to pay for Bail-outs and excesses and rip-offs of Americans.  You're watching the results now, as world markets tank around the globe -- all fiat based.  Soon, American's retirement portfolios will be damaged beyond belief.  The dismantling of the middle-class is well on it's way if you haven't noticed.  In 2 weeks you have seen Trillions of hard-earned taxpayer investments "Disappear" in a flash, while Bail-out side deals are pouring "off-the-books" millions into cronies portfolios for ramming this piece-of-sh*t Bail-out Robbery down American's throats. 

Mark is right -- Dems/Repugs are both complicit and the e-pity-me of cowardly fraudsters.  So, a non-vote is a middle-finger to the system, while taking care of your own, and working outside of the fake money system enrichment scam can give you some piece of mind.  Read up on Ron Paul's comments about the Federal Reserve.  See the artciles on www.silverseek.com or www.goldseek.com.  Cooperative alliances of the people, barter, exchange of tangibles etc. will soon be the means of survival in a virtual world of fiat money gone wild.

The two-party system can play with itself all it wants, by itself.  Step outside their paradigm.  Hold them accountable and point out their lying, fraudulent scams, and don't support them with anything.  They will fall of their own dead weight.  Starve them by using real money -- they hate it!

by boomerang (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 556 comments [215 recommended, 1 rejected]) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 6:58:23 AM

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Both parties are traitores liars but for some reason Rob is promoting the idea that one is better than the other. Is it  that he is trying to continue to sell the idea that this system can work? Sounds to me like he is playing right into the elites hands by trying to promote faith in the system. What we need is to wake up and see the fact that this system is lost. And stop playing the elites game. SAD!

by arlen custer (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 466 comments [69 recommended, 1 rejected]) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 7:52:59 AM

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there is a utube interview by alex jones of congressman brad sherwood? who states that bush & co threatened martial law if the bailout wasn't passed.

does anyone have anymore info on this event than the 2 minute statement that jones put on video?

 it is real clear that unless the people of this country rise up to change the entire electoral process there is little hope.  we need to get a Clean Election process going nationally, abolish the electoral college, and revise the governement so we have a representative form of leadership.  without these 3 things we, the people, can have little effect.

it is a historical reality that the constitution was never really meant to create a real democracy for the people, despite all the rhetoric.  ruling elite wrote the document and intended to stay in that position.  there are always a few odd balls who thought well of a democracy, but history clearly shows the true effects and intentions of the rulers.   

change is needed, but we need to change our focus for how to create real change.  one individual in office in this structure can do very little.  look at cynthia mckinney or dennis kucinich.  and let's not forget paul wellstone who they assassinated--yes, that is what it was!  is it any wonder that a person like obama jumps so quickly to the middle?  his life is truly on the line. 

by tanya (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 37 comments) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 8:13:16 AM

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Where was Obama born? I cannot find where his mother was hospitalized in Hawaii at the time of his birth. His certificate of birth ,on his website is a fake. Can you prove that he is Natural born American?

by qtfoot (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 1 comments) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 8:15:05 AM

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Maybe he wasn't born in a hospital.  Some babies aren't!

by Jill Herendeen (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 213 comments [13 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 3:38:37 PM

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"What kind of person sells out his or her country for gain? Most would call them traitors. "

By your own words, then, Obama is also a traitor. Since he AND his running mate both voted for the "Bail Out" (along with McCain) they have without a doubt not only sold out the people of this country but shown exactly how ruled they are by Wall Street and their wealthy contributers.. Anyone who plans on voting for Obama after this fiasco has no reason to criticize McCain. They are too similar for it to make a difference. Vote 3rd Party if you want true change, and if you want a president who actually cares about what you think and what you want.

by Kathleen Opon (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 2 comments) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 9:01:49 AM

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If the Dems win, Rob is correct:

Of course, in two years, there's a good chance that even the best efforts of the Democrats, who will sweep the elections in November, will fail at turning around the economic disaster we are just in the middle of. In two years, when it it is likely that it will become clear that the Democratic leadership made a massive error in supporting the $700 billion bailout and, probably more bailouts to follow, the lying traitors may start looking pretty good in comparison to the economic cowards who obeyed Bush and Paulson and ignored their constituents.

The lying traitors will start to look good. How appalling awful! But it will happen, as it has over and over again for years.

Is this what we really want? Is this how to show the rest of the world just how democracy works? We are hypocrites in the bargain.

I don't want lying traitors or economic cowards as leaders. I want my vote to go to someone who will take my opinions into account when making decisions. In November 2008 I do not see this happening. I refuse to vote for either the traitors and murderers or the economic cowards.

We need a new form of government that is led to and driven by the people. I am not an advocate for violence (even though the government is) but we need to begin anew. I am not giving up, but I can't vote for either side. Sarah Palin is just a sideshow for me. If she disgusts one person enough not to vote, it was worth it.

by Sharon Froehlich (0 articles, 9 quicklinks, 1 diaries, 32 comments) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 10:40:42 AM

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Tanya: You can go to the CSPAN.org web site and play the House and Senate debates. I haven't ever done it as I watch Cspan but see if you can. I have both of Representatives videos(a repub and a dem) in my fave file that has the Martial Law statements so I can view it over and over. ha.

Steve, even if my vote doesn't count, which this year "it may just might" make a difference in MT as our delegates may go Dem for the first time since Mansfield. I want to practice my civil liberty of voting if even for the hellofit. I have my ballot sitting here, and I am afraid to get started (first time for that). Notice the bailout "may" work, "might" work and that's all they ever say about it. So I call it the "may just might" bailout. We know it works for the corporate King but it will never work for us bottom feeders and the middle class.

I find fascism so disgusting. I will vote as we have a pressing Governors race and Senate and Representative race. If Mac becomes Prez, he will die and my worst nightmare, Palin will become the woman on the horse. She will force all births and then the Rothschilds and Rockefellers tribes will have plenty of babies to sacrifice for their King of Darkness. Some don't realize just how dark this all goes.

I believe China will come for their money. A pissed off President Hu is not a good thing, not good at all.

by shirley reese (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 592 comments [98 recommended, 1 rejected]) on Wednesday, Oct 8, 2008 at 9:43:56 PM

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