LY: It seems to me that there are
three or four approaches to reforming a corrupt government: work within the
system, by running for office and replacing them; expose corruption and hope
the people will respond by throwing them out; ignore government entirely and
create a community-based democratic system from within; or outright revolution,
as Jefferson thought might be necessary - although I have a hard time imagining
the people having a gunfight with the Pentagon. If reform fails, there is expatriation to a
more democratic country, a process that is becoming more difficult, as most
countries now demand a lot of capital as a condition of residency. What are
your thoughts on this?
(Edit: Obama's recent speech on inequality may
be an indication that the OWS strategy will do just that. Time will tell.)
Jesse: First of all, revolution is off the table. It would be like declaring war on the Atlantic Ocean. We need to work both within the system, and be engaged in policy making, and outside of the system. We need both. The stick and the carrot. First we need to register as many voters as possible - if 70% voted, we would get a representative government. If you do not vote, you are part of the problem.
We also need to be in the streets. We need boots on the ground. The only way we can counter corporate money in politics is for everybody to participate. It is now or never. If we fail to redress these wrongs, we will live with the consequences [for generations to come.]
There are several options we need to look at: 1 - We need to primary Obama, primary the Democrats [as the Tea party has primaried Republicans]. Right now we live in a closed society, and Congress is in the process of closing it further. 2 -We need a constitutional convention of the people only - not the pols. 3 -We need to have a general strike. If you are going to steal our civil liberties we will steal your prosperity. There is no other way. We need to get to their bottom line. 4 - We need a "national throw your TV out the window day". 5 - We need a Workers' Bill of Rights, a Declaration of Economic Rights.
(edit - FDR introduced an Economic Bill of Rights late in his presidency but died before he could enact it. Everything in FDR's plan (a living wage, decent housing, healthcare for all, a good education) was guaranteed to the Germans and the Japanese after WWII via the Marshall plan, but none of those guarantees were enacted in the United States).
LY: Last Thursday the Senate passed - with only 7 dissenting
votes - the National
Defense Authorization Act of 2012, a bill that alters the
definition and treatment of terrorist suspects in important ways. It contains
some ominously vague language -
"any person who substantially
supports al qaeda or associated
groups or is belligerent,
anywhere in the world including within the United States and including American
citizens" - language that could
allow the military, not the police or the FBI, to arrest and detain indefinitely any person
they (the military) accused ( not proved) to fit into that definition. In other
words, it nullifies habeas corpus, and the right to due process for all
American citizens, whether they live here or in any other country. Four amendments were introduced that in
various ways removed the unconstitutional language from the bill, and all were
voted down. Congressman Jerrold Nadler described the bill as
"tyranny", and constitutional attorneys call it
"traitorous". (See Colonel Wilkerson's analysis at the above link.) It
has been suggested that Congress and K Street are so frightened of a popular
uprising that they passed this bill in order to guarantee themselves the
protection of the military on American soil. Obama has threatened to veto it,
but we have no guarantee that he will. In any case, as was shown by the
assassinations of Al-Awlaki and his family (all American citizens) by drone attacks in Yemen, the president
claims the right to assassinate any person, even an American citizen, without
charges or trial. It is possible that this bill could be used to A put the
military on our streets and B to quash dissent,
What would that mean for the
Occupy movement and how would you respond to it?
Ryan: If we were under martial law, I would be looking at Brazil.
Lex: The world seems to be gearing up for civil war on a global scale. We are leaderless and decentralized, and we are our own protection against the use of force. Before Occupy became a reality, I had given up on our ability to create change. Now I am in this for the long haul - no matter what.
Jesse: If Obama signs the bill, his presidency is over today. This is McCarthy on a cocaine binge. Any person could be thrown into the gulag over nothing.
LY: Are we living in an American version of Stalin's Russia then?Jesse: It is more like the Colonial period, when colonists lived under British law. The captains of industry make their own laws; they want the rest of us to be quiet, obedient, peasants. I fear for my country now.
LY: What else would you like Americans to know? Any closing thoughts?
Ryan: Dissent is patriotic. Wake up, people. We need to fight back. If you are not willing to say "No", to dissent against a system that is out to cut your own throat, then you are part of the problem.
Jesse: Start reading. Register to vote. Inform yourselves. .... And if you don't have a uterus, you have nothing to say about abortion.
Lex: Occupy's greatest contribution is to liberate people from fear. We are being told, "If you don't let us strip search you, the terrorists will win." "Ownership makes you a person." "If you run out of capital you don't exist anymore". Community is the key to breaking that fear. By rebuilding community, we have brought back the sense that if the system abandons you or if you abandon the system in search of something better, you will not lose your value. We validate each other and give each other the strength to keep contributing. We can build a world that makes sense - whether the people in power want that to happen or not.
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