Paying taxes of any sort is one of the least-pleasant activities any American can experience, including those level-headed taxpayers who know that taxation is an important and necessary function of a civilized nation.
Our Founding Fathers knew that well. When listing the powers of Congress in Article I, Section 8, of the United States Constitution, the power of taxation was the first one they named proving wrong the claim by anti-tax propagandists that the US was founded on anti-tax sentiments.
Since the beginning of the nation, there has always been a movement to escape taxation by some that would result in transferring taxes to someone else, all of which are fraudulently labeled "tax reform."
The most damaging and harmful tax movements of late have been the cutting of taxes for the nation's aristocracy and transferring the tax load to the working middle class. That began in earnest in the Ronald Reagan presidential administration and has been carried to its ruinous extreme by the current George W. Bush administration.
When not cutting taxes for themselves, anti-tax proponents dream up new and more-novel plans to make the tax codes more unfair for others and more beneficial for themselves.
One tax scheme was proposed by magazine publisher Malcolm Forbes, who ran for president in 2000 with his only platform proposal being a flat tax on income. Forbes, a multimillionaire, earned his great fortune by two strokes of genius: 1) being born; and 2) waiting for daddy to die.
Forbes failed to mention that under his flat tax, in which dividend and interest income were untaxed, he could have had his $500 million fortune stashed away earning only 5% for a $25 million annual tax-free income. It apparently slipped his mind that he should have mentioned that fact or the fact that the "death tax" on inheritances never prevented him from becoming extremely wealthy for doing nothing.
No person should ever take advice on wealth building from someone who inherited great wealth and no nation should base its tax laws on the proposals of one who would greatly benefit from those laws.
Others periodically offer the nation a sales tax of 23% up to 34% to replace the income tax, payroll taxes, capital-gains tax, inheritance tax and all other taxes. Proponents call the proposal "The Fair Tax," but like all sales taxes, the burden would fall more heavily on the middle class and less so on the wealthy. What proponents also forget to mention is that, while the working American is busy all year long at the job and paying the steep sales tax, the proponents, who could be reaping a small fortune from their investments, could well be off on a yacht stopping in all the Caribbean locations, which, surprisingly, wouldn't have the US sales tax in force. Or they could just settle down in the Italian villas their vast fortunes purchased and, surprisingly again, could avoid paying the US sales tax.
Others propose a "value-added tax" which would have the same effect. Under this plan, a sales tax based on the added value of a commodity is added to the cost of that item at each stop in its development or movement through the economic system. An example would apply to the lumbering industry that framed the author's formative years. A tree has no economic value standing in the forest. When it is harvested and sold to a lumber mill, a tax is added. After the log is sawed into lumber, another tax is added when that lumber is sold to a distributor for a price that also recoups the initial tax. Another tax is added when the distributor sells the lumber to a lumber yard, which adds another tax when sold to a customer, either a contractor of an individual. If sold to a contractor, another tax is added when the lumber, used in construction, is sold as part of a building. This total tax is paid by the end user, which is the individual, not the business or corporation. And the elite sailing the Caribbean on his yacht or taking life easy at an Italian villa pays no US tax.
As an example of the scam of national sales or value-added taxes is an American actor, educated and trained with American tax dollars who may receive $20 million American dollars to film an American movie for an American producer in Vancouver (no US taxes there) to be played in American theaters with American moviegoers paying $10 American (oops, that might be the cost before several layers of "value-added taxes" were heaped on). Then the actor and the producer could take their American loot to their Riviera villas and never pay a cent in American taxes while the American earning $20,000 annually as a sewer worker (ala Ed Norton) pays all the taxes. That is advertised as a "fair tax" by those backing the scam.
Others who benefit from the US economy simply make no bones about their desire to escape US taxation. Halliburton, the giant oil-services corporation once headed by Vice President Dick Cheney, has abandoned its Texas birth place to run off to Dubai to escape US taxes all the while feasting on American defense contracts, many associated with the war on Iraq.
The Boston Globe reported in March about another scam perpetrated by an American corporation under the headline:
Shell companies in Cayman Islands allow KBR to avoid Medicare, Social Security deductions.
The Globe reported:
Cayman Islands - Kellogg Brown & Root, the nation's top Iraq war contractor and until last year a subsidiary of Halliburton Corp., has avoided paying hundreds of millions of dollars in federal Medicare and Social Security taxes by hiring workers through shell companies based in this tropical tax haven.
More than 21,000 people working for KBR in Iraq - including about 10,500 Americans - are listed as employees of two companies that exist in a computer file on the fourth floor of a building on a palm-studded boulevard here in the Caribbean. Neither company has an office or phone number in the Cayman Islands.
*****************************************************
Thomas Bonsell is a former newspaper editor (in Oregon, New York and Colorado) United States Air Force cryptanalyst and National Security Agency intelligence agent. He became one of American journalism's leading constitutional experts through years of study at Georgetown University Graduate School of Government in Washington, D.C., and tries (without much success) to be patient with people who argue endlessly on subjects they have never studied. He is the author of "The Un-Americans: Trashing of the United States Constitution in the American Press", a critique of the mainstream media for ignorance of, or disdain for, our constitutional principles of self-government. He left newspaper work years ago, disgusted at the direction the Fourth Estate ~ under the mismanagement of ineffectual, out-of-touch, can't-do executives ~ was taking away from honest responsible journalism and the observation that there was no place in the mainstream media for a progressive, or liberal, constitutional "expert". Bonsell is an honors graduate of Woodbury College (Los Angeles, California) with a bachelor of business administration degree. He is profiled in Marquis Who's Who in America. (Self-portrait, above, was handled to make author/artist appear prettier than he actually is.)
Personal motto: Have brain; will use.
Obama: Only Presidential Candidate Supporting S.681
S.681
Title: A bill to restrict the use of offshore tax havens and abusive tax shelters to inappropriately avoid Federal taxation, and for other purposes.
Sponsor: Sen Levin, Carl [MI] (introduced 2/17/2007) Cosponsors (4)
Related Bills: H.R.2136
Latest Major Action: 2/17/2007 Referred to Senate committee. Status: Read twice and referred to the Committee on Finance.
________________________________________
COSPONSORS(4), ALPHABETICAL [followed by Cosponsors withdrawn]: (Sort: by date)
Sen Coleman, Norm [MN] - 2/17/2007
Sen Obama, Barack [IL] - 2/17/2007
Sen Salazar, Ken [CO] - 8/1/2007
Sen Whitehouse, Sheldon [RI] - 7/11/2007
H.R.2136
Title: To restrict the use of offshore tax havens and abusive tax shelters to inappropriately avoid Federal taxation, and for other purposes.
Sponsor: Rep Doggett, Lloyd [TX-25] (introduced 5/3/2007) Cosponsors (46)
Related Bills: S.681
Latest Major Action: 6/4/2007 Referred to House subcommittee. Status: Referred to the Subcommittee on Courts, the Internet, and Intellectual Property.
by
Paul Sheldon Foote (8 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 40 comments)
on Saturday, April 19, 2008 at 7:36:33 AM
In this article Mr Bonsell sounds as though he has a great deal of wealth envy. Such envy comes from those who are missing either the desire or the intelegence required to become wealthy themselves. I can think of only one other possible source, that being the requirement for a progressive income tax as stated by Karl Marx in his "Communist Manifesto".
The fact remains that this country will never be able to compete globally so long as it taxes productivity. Only by changing to a consumption based system can the high productivity American companies compete with lower wage countries around the world.
by
Dewey715 (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 12 comments)
on Saturday, April 19, 2008 at 7:42:22 AM
Sure, I have a wealth envy. That's why I have been retired since age 45 living on the income from my investments.
Maybe a better explanation is that I do have the intelligence, education and good sense to see a scam when I see it, and our taxing system has been a scam since the rise of the conservative majority.
I fail to see what you mean by being uncompetitive by taxing productivity. We have been taking taxes off corporations for decades and are becoming less competitive ever since. Since every dollar ever paid in taxes must come from economic activity in some fashion, how do you propose maintaining a civilized nation by not taxing productivity?
I have written a piece telling how to tax fairly, how to eliminate the deficits the conservatives live on and how to get us out of the mess created by one Ronald Reagan and two George Bushes. Read it at:
Warren Buffett has long deplored the unfairness of the United States tax system. Does the richest man in America (the world?) suffer from "wealth envy"?
The Gateses (of Microsoft fame) have long cited the unfairness of the taxing system. Do Bill Gates senior and junior experience "wealth envy"? And is it possible that they know nothing of taxes. business, economics or law?
This begs the question: "How much utter stupidity is a right-winger capable of flinging about? And do they expect the rest of us to be so obtuse we can't recognize their crap?
by
tabonsell (28 articles, 0 quicklinks, 22 diaries, 250 comments)
on Saturday, April 19, 2008 at 5:43:17 PM
Tabonsell is Spot-On, on the current, ANTI-WORKER Taxes$!
The American Worker, ie the Everyman, and WOMAN, out there, the American CITIZENRY, is far too OVERBURDENED by the present, overall American taxation system.
Furthermore, he's completely correct in stating the utter S$cams that are intrins$ic in such "simple cures" and quick-"Fixes$"{they're certainly and totally FIXED, alright! All against the average American WORKER, STUDENT, Consumer and Impverished American CITIZENRY, as well] promoted as well, in the initial, "Pres$idential" Primary Stages, by the LIBERTICIDAL, Darwinis$tic, Pro-Profiteers$, "Libertarians$," fellow RIGHTIS$T, "CHRIS$TIAN" Mike HUCKABEE, who is INDEED, ultimately, just ANOTHER, FECKLESS$ HACK, of a FAS$CISTIC, BULLYING, S$CAPEGOATING, HATER of the Poor, the Disabled, the Elderly, and the Over-taxed, underpaid, average, GOOD, Honest American WORKERS, and truth-Seeking College Students, etcetera, ... and I believe NOT a PHONY, HUCKS$TER'S$ ranted "word" or "thought" coming out of the "Chris$$$tian" vocal BLOW-HOLE of such "Chris$tians$" as Former Governor HUCKABEE; you are fully indentified and "Tagged," S$HEEPLE, if YOU too, believe His, Huckabee's simple Tax "Cures$," or Ron PAUL'S$$ DARWINIS$TICALLY-DRIPPING of DEMONIC HATREDS$ for America's Poores$t and Hardest Working CITIZENRY, as well!
Additionally, you LIBERTICIDAL, FAS$CISTIC S$IMPS$ for the RIGHTIS$T Paul, who NOW doth s$o greatly favor a FULLY FATTENEED up National "DEFENS$E" ie "Private," American TAXPAYERS$ GOUGING OFFENS$IVE Military, Pro-"Pre-Emptive WARS$" ATTACKS$-Favoring National "Defens$e" and IN-"S$ECURITY," TERRORIS$M-Inducing, and CREATING, pro-Military budget, PAUL is NOW, S$lavis$hly in favor of THAT!
Where, TOO, is the "Purist-Constitutionalist," Ron PAUL, when it comes to his, at the Very LEAST, signing on to, and Fully and Vocally SUPPORTING fellow Representative, Dennis KUCINICH's HR 333 Bill of IMPEACHMENT agains$t Dick CHENEY, that would UNDOUBTEDLY lead right to GW BUS$H, under any Logical, Cogent, and Badly-NEEDED{*for our Republic's very SURVIVAL, HERR "Dr." PAUL, Sir!) IMPEACHMENT Process, of this allegedly, twice "Elected" Adminis$tration?!
WHY, also, hath the "Libertarians$" Ron PAUL, not YET returned or donated, to NAACP, etc., that $500.00, that his$ FELLOW BULLYING RIGHTIS$T-Hater, and "Former" head and member of the FAS$CIST "Stormfront," Political "Group," of THUGS$, why has PAUL not yet returned that money to his FELLOW Hater of the Weak and the Non-Whites$, AND of the American WORKERS$, from that Rightist STORMFRONT, Demonic "Being" who gave Paul's$ campaign the $500.00?!
Because such as "Stormfront's$" members ARE Paul's FELLOW HATERS$ and Fellow SCAPEGOATERS$, of the POOR, the Disabled, of Good and Honest UNDERPAID and OVERTAXED American WORKERS$, and UNIONS$, The ELDERLY, Truth-Seeking College STUDENTS, etcetera, that's why the WHINY Dr. Ronny PAUL never wants to give back what his fellow RIGHTIST-HATERS have donated to HIM!), the Liberticidal, DARWiNIS$TIC, and Ultimately, Pro-WAR-DIS$ASTER, and Human MIS$ERY PROFITEERS$, the "Libertarians," these utterly and S$Hameless$ly CRUEL{*they WORS$HIP a "Thinker," named Ayn RAND, whose 1982 "Funeral" had a HUGE Floral Bouquet made out of an American DOLLAR "$$$SIGN"?! And "Former" Fed Chairman, ALAN GREENSPAN, is also a Fellow ZEALOUS$$$ Devotee of AYN RAND? WHAT would Rep. PAUL have to say about Greenspan's POLICIES$ at the Federal Reserve, which PAUL "claims to be so fervantly against" its existence, yet his FELLOW LBERTARIAN, GREENSPAN, who got America into most of the Financial "Messes$," ie like the "Mis$take:" of the IRAQ etc. WARS$ for the WAR and Oil PROFITEERS$, ... that got into the Fed;'s recent BAIL-OUT, to the tune of $30 Billion dollars$$, just to start, Paul's mere RHETORIC on Capital Hill, that he opposes the Bail-out, is not ENOUGH, nay, it is indeed mere "S$MOKE and MIRRORS$," which have been fully IMPLEMENTED over these past, sad and TRAGIC decades$, since Paul's FELLOW LIBERTARIAN-REPUBS-RIGHTIS$T "American," Ronny O'REAGAN, assumed Office on January 20th, 1981 AD!
And Paul, and his FELLOW REPUBLICANS$, "Libertarians$," and rightis$t dlc "DEMOCRATS$$$," IS, correctly, AND SADLY, AND TRAGICALLY, COUNTING ON THE ATTENTION-S$PANLESS$ DIMWITS$, AND S$HEEPLE, THAT MAKE UP FAR TOO MUCH OF TODAY'S$ AMERICAN "CITIZENRY," IE THE "CONS$UMERS$," WHO SIMPLY ARE, no LONGER CITIZENS, UNDER CORPORATISTS$ LIKE KING GW BUS$H, AND BARACK OBAMA, AND MCCAIN-CLINTON "TICKET," AND ULTIMATELY UNDER THEIR FELLOW RIGHTIS$T ELITIS$T RON PAUL, AS WELL; ONLY CYNTHIA MCKINNEY FROM THE GREEN PARTY, AND YES, RALPH NADER AS WELL, OFFER TRULY, ANTI-PROFITEERINGS$ POLICIES$ AND REFORMS, AND WELL, OF COURSE, DENNIS KUCINICH, AND YES, MR. PAUL, HIS HR 333, NEEDED bILL OF IMPEACHMENT THAT YOU STILL REFUSE TO SIGN ONTO AND SUPPORT, HE, KUCINICH DID SUPPORT A TRUE AMERICAN PEOLE AND WORKER-FAVORING, FULLY OVERHAULED US TAX S$YSTEM, BUT OF COURSE THE THIEVING CORPORATISTS$' WAR AND MIS$ERY PROFITEERS$' "news$" MEDIA, ALLOWED THE AMERICAN s$heeple, AND WILLFULLY "IGNORANT," & ALWAYS INTELLECTUALLY lazyS$, FORMER AMERICAN CITIZENRY, TO HEAR NONE OF MR. KUCINICH'S REAL TAXATION-REFORM PROPOSALS, AND HIS REAL, SANE AND OF COURSE GRADUAL[HOW ELSE CAN ONE EVER WITHDRAWAL OVER 300,000 IN TOTAL US TROOPS$ AND "pRIVATE" CONTRACTORS$-PROFITEERS$$, FROM IRAQ, OR ANYWHERE?!], ... WITHDRAWAL OF US TROOPS$ AND "pRIVATE" TAXPAYERS$ GOUGING "CONTRACTORS$" FROM IRAQ, TO BE LARGELY REPLACED[KUCINICH WAS NOT AT ALL AGAINST A CERTAIN NUMER OF REGULAR US GOVT. TROOPS, NON TAXPAYERS$ GOUGING, war pROFITEERING, TERRORIS$M-CREATING "CONTRACTORS" BUT US GOVT. TROOPS COULD STAY BEHIND IN IRAQ, TO FIGHT TERROR GROUPS ONLY, AND TO ALSO, HAVE THESE TROOPS BE FULLY REPLACED WITH UN AND OR ARAB LEAGUE MUSLIM AND OTHER NATIONS' PEACEKEEPING TROOPS! THAT, IS NOT A TOTAL RETREAT AND WITHDRAWAL. ANY TRUE AND HONEST MILITARY SCIENTIST WILL TELL YOU SO).
INDEED, YOU $SATAN-WORSHIPPING, DEMONIC AND CRUEL, LIBERTICIDAL LIBERTARIANS$, AND YOUR RIGHTIS$T REPUBLICANS$/CHRIS$TIANS$, AND OTHER HATE GROUPS$ AND DLC "DEMOCRATS$," CLOSE CORPORATE THIEVERY ENABLING ALLIES$, YOU DEMONS$ MAY WELL GAIN FULL AND TOTAL FAS$CIST POWERS IN THIS NOW FORMER LAND AND NATION-STATE, OF AMERICA, WITH ITS NOW EVER MORE FECKLESS$, SELFIS$H AND INTELLECTUALLY LAZY "aMERICANS$," GIVEN JUST ONE MORE "mAJOR tERRORIS$Ts$' ATTACKS$, IE FALSE FLAG ATTACKS$, IKE THOSE SOMEHOW ALLOWED FOR HOURS$, 9/11 ATTACKS$, YOU RIGHTIS$T MAY WELL WIN "IT ALL," IN THE VERY NEAR FUTURE, YET AS WELL, "LIBERTARIANS$," HETERS OF THE TRUE AMERICAN COMMONWEAL, THOUGH YES, I BE A MULTI-RELIGION FOLLOWING, HIGHLY ECUMENICAL, 'fALLEN CATHOLIC"{AND HATER ALSO OF ALL OF THE COVERED UP CHILD-ABUSER-HIDING "PEOPLE," NOW HEADING THE FORMER CATHOLIC CHURCH, IN THE NOW VISITING, EVIL VISAGE, OF "POPE" BENEDICT{*WHO YES, HE IS A BENDICT ARNOLD LIKE TRAITOR, TO ALL THE TRULY MERCIFUL CATHOLIC VALUES THAT I LEARNED AS A YOUNG CHILD], BUT i DO REMEMBER THE FAMOUS QUOTE AND i PARAPHRASE FROM THE TRUE JESUS, IE JOSHUA, IE THE TRUE CHRIST AND NOT "chris$t," IE THE TRUE PRINCE OF PEACE, JESUS WHO ONCE HATH SPOKEN: "WHAT GOOD IS IT, BROTHERS, IF YOUR ACTIONS "PROFIT" YOU ALL THE WEALTH OF THE ENTIRE WORLD, IF YOU LOSE YOUR VERY "SOUL"{IE YOUR MORALS, NOT "MORALS$," YOU DAMNED AND DAMNABLE liberticidal, "LIBERTARIANS$" AND YOUR FELLOW RIGHTIS$TS AND FAS$CISTS!], ... IN THE PROCESS?"
And, ... YOU MAY WELL, ... "WIN IT ALL," BUT YOU SHALL REMAIN, UTTERLY S$HAMELESS, $SCAPEGOATER$, and hater$ of the Poor, the Disabled, The Homeless[over 50% of whom are MY Fellow American Military VETERANS$, for THES$E DAMNED iraq ETCETERA WARS$ WAGED FOR YOUR FELLOW WAR, OIL AND MIS$ERY-DISAS$TER PROFITEERS$! THAT IS ALL, THANK YOU, FROM "FORMER" US MARINE, AND "FORMER" HARVARD SCHOLAR{THAT'S EVEN 'CRAZIER," THAT MY PAST STUDIES AT THAT "UNIVERSITY OF THE US MARINE CORPS," FOLKS!
FELLOW "AMERICANS$," NOW TURNED MERE "FREE" MARKET, IE s$LAVE LABOR AND WAR, ETCETERA, PROFITEERS$ -=INFES$TED, 'GLOBALIS$TIC," 'MARKETPLACE," CONS$UMERS$, NOW PLEASE, WAKE THE "HANNITY," WAKE THE H-LL, UP, WILL YOU PLEASE, DO SO?! "DO IT, NOW!" MY "NICE"{?!] MARINE CORPS DRILL INSTRUCTORS, USED TO TELL ME.
PEACEFUL EVOLUTIONARY, AND not BLOODY "REVOLUTIONARY" ACTIONS$ ARE NOW NEEDED, IE BOYCOTTS${AND NOT WARS$!!] WITHOUT END, ETCETERA, ETCETERA! THAT IS ALL.
by
Brian O'Moore (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 37 comments)
on Saturday, April 19, 2008 at 10:59:25 AM
It is tabonsell that is just plain wrong, not the anti-tax campaigners. Let him and anyone interested in the subject watch the late Aaron Russo's excellent documentary, 'America - Freedom to Fascism' http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5355374476580235299
and they will see THERE IS NO LAW REQUIRING WAGE EARNERS TO PAY INCOME TAX (admittedly, it does sound incredible, but check the video out).
by
Paul Barbara (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 7 comments)
on Sunday, April 20, 2008 at 10:31:55 AM
If we listen to this nonsense about there being no law requiring Americans to pay a tax on their income, we have to believe the unbelievable.
We first had an income tax to pay for the Civil War. When that tax was ruled unconstitutional (direct taxation) Congress had to make it legal to pay for World War I, so it passed the 16th Amendment and sent it to the states for ratification. The states ratified it and it became the "supreme law of the land" and made an income tax constitutional.
Now our fools claiming there is no law on income taxes want us to believe that after going through that creation and ratification process, Congress forgot to pass a law.
Then, after nearly a century listening to the same old same old, Congress again has failed to pass a income-tax law. Even though thousands of tax criminals have used the argument to no avail, apparently Congress again has failed to pass an income-tax law.
Get real, righties. Anyone who can read knows that Congress constantly enacts tax laws of all sorts each year, including laws on the income tax.
Your arguments that there is no law requiring payment of income taxes make you look like total fools.
.
by
tabonsell (28 articles, 0 quicklinks, 22 diaries, 250 comments)
on Monday, April 21, 2008 at 1:21:59 PM
Since the Internal Revenue Code is online, perhaps you'd be kind enough to show us the law that requiers us to pay the income tax?
Also, how do you reconcile the requierment to file returns with the 5th Amendment? Isn't filing a return that can be used against you in court bearing witness against ones self?
How about audits? Doesn't the 4th Amendment requier the IRS to get a warrant before it can look at anything?
These last 2 are actually the strongest arguments against the income tax. Its unenforcable without violating the Constitution.
by
Darren Wolfe (4 articles, 125 quicklinks, 79 diaries, 598 comments)
on Friday, April 25, 2008 at 8:00:58 PM
My article wasn't about laws requiring taxes to be paid it was about tax laws screwing most Americans in favor of the few. Get it right.
Since the United States Constitution is also on line, perhaps you will be kind enough to show us where the power of Congress to COLLECT taxes on income is invalid in spite of the 16th Amendment saying otherwise.
If you could understand the 5th Amendment you would know it applies only to CRIMINAL TRIAL. Requiring the filing of a return does not involve a CRIMINAL TRIAL, making your argument nonsense. Tell Martha Stewart she has a constitutional right to lie to investigators.
The 4th Amendment prohibits UNREASONABLE searches and seizures. Since the 16th Amendment authorizes the COLLECTION of taxes an audit isn't unreasonable.
Your arguments indicate a total lack of knowledge about virtually everything having to do with our Constitution.
by
tabonsell (28 articles, 0 quicklinks, 22 diaries, 250 comments)
on Saturday, April 26, 2008 at 1:25:54 PM
Since the United States Constitution is also on line, perhaps you will be kind enough to show us where the power of Congress to COLLECT taxes on income is invalid in spite of the 16th Amendment saying otherwise.
Nice 2 step. You come up with the citation first, as I requested.
If you could understand the 5th Amendment you would know it applies only to CRIMINAL TRIAL. Requiring the filing of a return does not involve a CRIMINAL TRIAL, making your argument nonsense.
When they use your tax return against you in a criminal trial.....do I really need to explain this further?
The 4th Amendment prohibits UNREASONABLE searches and seizures. Since the 16th Amendment authorizes the COLLECTION of taxes an audit isn't unreasonable.
You're advocating a dictatorship. Under your rules the gov can do anything it wants, the Constitution becomes meaningless.
The Constitution also says that counterfiting is illegal. Would you advocate that the Feds be able to go around checking peoples cash at random too?
Here's the 4th Amendment:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
It clearly says that the gov needs a warrant to search anything. The studiouisly ignored 9th & 10th Amendments only reinforce this:
Amendment IX
The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.
Amendment X
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.
by
Darren Wolfe (4 articles, 125 quicklinks, 79 diaries, 598 comments)
on Sunday, April 27, 2008 at 10:13:50 AM
I know what the Constitution says; i studied it extensively in the graduate school of one of America's top universities under some of the finest legal minds in America. You have studied nothing. I adhere to the Constitution completely, you distort what it says.
The 4th Amendment prohibits "unreasonable searches and seizures." Your inability to read doesn't change that.
The Fifth Amendment says "criminal cases" and "testimony"; need I say more to someone who can't read? I would show you how to read between the lines to see what Madison was talking about, but it's clear you have not the intelligence to understand.
How did you get so out of touch with reality?. Of course the government can use your false statements and lies against you in trial except when made as part of testimony in court. Of course the government can try you for perjury. Of course the government can jail you for fraud of any sort.
Get real. The 16th Amendment clearly says that the government can collect taxes on income. When you subvert that legal power of government, when you obstruct that constitutional power, when you impede government from doing what the Constitution says it has the power to do, you are committing a crime and all the ignorance in the world about our Constitution isn't going to change that.
The more you rattle on about something you know nothing about, the more you make you "libertarian" movement look foolish.
by
tabonsell (28 articles, 0 quicklinks, 22 diaries, 250 comments)
on Sunday, April 27, 2008 at 12:46:08 PM
But first I wish to thank you for the exchange in which you accused me of saying things I never said or wrote, then trying to convince me I said and wrote them.
For insulting my intelligence by pretending you know more about a subject I studied under some of the finest minds in the nation while you never studied it a minute.
For pretending to be a constitutional expert but never stating where your expertise came from all the while trying to con someone who does have such expertise.
For ignoring the valid points I know to be true and pretending your opinion is superior to my knowledge.
For trying to tell me what I think without being qualified to tell me any such thing.
For always evading the point and pretending it wasn't presented to you.
For accusing me of advocating a police state after I spent several years as an intelligent agent protecting you from police states from all over the world.
For using that standard right-wing tactic of distorting what someone said then using that distortion as a weapon to continue attacking.
And for presenting an ideology that I clearly see as anti-Constitution and un-
American.
by
tabonsell (28 articles, 0 quicklinks, 22 diaries, 250 comments)
on Monday, April 28, 2008 at 12:07:50 PM
Of course the government can use your false statements and lies against you in trial except when made as part of testimony in court. Of course the government can try you for perjury. Of course the government can jail you for fraud of any sort.
This is where your strange interpretation of the 5th Amendment comes in. If one makes a voluntary statement to a gov agent & lies, then you'd be correct in saying they had broken the law. If one could refuse to file, but chose to do so anyway & lied, fine. They volunteered the info. They broke the law & the Constitution doesn't protect that. However, tax returns aren't voluntary, that's the crucial difference. Using this info that is coerced out of people in court against them is being forced to bear witness against oneself:
10. Forced Self-Incrimination.The requirement to file tax returns under penalty of perjury counters the spirit of the Fifth Amendment protection against self-incrimination. Citizens are prosecuted for failure to file, but by disclosing all the information demanded by the IRS, taxpayers are waiving their Fifth Amendment protections.
"On every question of construction (of the constitution) let us carry ourselves back to the time when the Constitution was adopted, recollect the spirit manifested in the debates, and instead of trying what meaning may be squeezed out of the text, or invented against it, conform to the probable one in which it was passed."
---- Thomas Jefferson, letter to William Johnson, June 12, 1823, The Complete Jefferson, p.322.
by
Darren Wolfe (4 articles, 125 quicklinks, 79 diaries, 598 comments)
on Monday, April 28, 2008 at 7:04:52 PM
