“… I have done such acts as looking (maybe lusting, I pray so hard that I wasn’t) at my self in skimpy underwear. Whenever I wear it I feel like a sexual sensation.
“Yesterday in the bathroom (in front of the mirror), I wiggled my body very rapidly, making my genitals bounce up and down. I get a little bit of that feeling mentioned above as I write this. After I did this, I immediately asked forgiveness of God, went in the shower but did it again there.”
According to that guru of purity and bastion of right-wing morality, James Dobson, the teenage “prehomosexual” who wrote the above words is “representative of many other preteens and teens around the world who have awakened to something terrifying within—something they don’t understand—something that creates enormous confusion and doubt. These kids often recognize very early in life that they are ‘different’ from other boys.”
I learned all this in Dobson’s book, Bringing Up Boys (Tyndale House Publishers, 2001), in Chapter 9, “The Origins of Homosexuality.” I’d heard much over the years about James Dobson, and the wonderful advice he gives to parents about how to raise kids. And given that as a parent and as a professional educator, I disagreed with everything I read or heard from him, I had long contemplated buying one of his books, in an attempt to see where this revered author was coming from, and maybe in the process get a handle on some of my own faulty thinking. After all, I suspect that he and I might actually agree that raising kids is the most important single thing we can do for the future of the human race.
As it turned out, this one chapter, which I flipped to for a preview, got me up to speed pretty quick. In an attempt to spare you from buying the whole book like I did (or possibly send you to it, if like millions of others you inherited the Dobson Worship Gene), I herein share some Dobsonian wisdom on the topic of homosexuality.
Not only are confused boys, such as the one above, different, but, if they are Christian, Mr. Dobson tells us, “Their sexual thoughts and feelings produce great waves of guilt accompanied by secret fears of divine retribution… There is no greater internal turmoil for a Christian boy or girl than this.”
This was a revelation to me.As someone who suffered through twelve years of Catholic school, with Dominican nuns beating me on a regular basis—mentally, if not physically—this sounded remarkably familiar. In fact, it seemed inconceivable that the internal turmoil I experienced could possibly be any greater for a “prehomosexual” than for a “preheterosexual,” such as I evidently was.I mean, if one is going to roast in the hot place for all eternity for the sin of sexual abuse, it would hardly seem to matter if the offense were done for homosexual or heterosexual motives.
However, I was pleased to learn that, according to Dobson, my miserable condition and suffering would not have been classified as a “disorder,” as such would be for prehomosexuals.
I also learned that the homosexual disorder is not typically chosen by suffering youths. And how do we know this? Notes James,“Who among us would knowingly choose a path that would result in alienation from family, rejection by friends, disdain from the heterosexual world, exposure to sexually transmitted diseases such as AIDS and tuberculosis, and even a shorter lifespan? No, homosexuality is not chosen, except in rare circumstances.” (Let us kindly overlook the fact that it is folks like Dobson who have done their best to create and perpetuate these joyful Christian conditions.)
Well, phew! I really would hate to think that such a fate was chosen, since in that case you’d obviously have to be an imbecile as well.On the other hand, this serious mental disorder called homosexuality is not genetic. Dobson offers several irrefutable proofs to ponder, such as this: “There are no respected geneticists in the world today who claim to have found a so-called ‘gay gene’ or other indicators of genetic transmission.”
One might surmise, based on similar lack of evidence, that there is no gene for heterosexuality either. From which one might logically conclude that there are no genes for sexuality. I realize this appears to fly in the face of various noted biologists, who claim that we are reproduction machines, tools of selfish genes who like nothing more than to reproduce themselves.
No matter.If absence of evidence doesn’t cut it for you, try this:“… if homosexuality were specifically inherited by a dominant gene pattern, it would tend to be eliminated from the human gene pool because those who have it tend not to reproduce.” Never mind that many debilitating inherited conditions preclude reproduction, for we are talking here about that most evil and sinful disorder, homosexuality.
I was also pleased to learn that homosexuality is not only not predetermined, but those afflicted with it actually can do something about it! How do we know this? Easy: “There are eight hundred known former gay and lesbian individuals today who have escaped from the homosexual lifestyle and found wholeness in their newfound heterosexuality.”
Forget the fact that these lucky eight hundred are some infinitesimal fraction of the gay and lesbian community, or that there may be something like eight million gays or lesbians suffering because they are afraid to reveal themselves: Indeed, James knows one of the lucky ones himself!
A friend of his, whose name I’ll spare, was once caught up in the gay community, participated in gay-pride parades, and was a cross-dresser. But this fortunate fellow “found forgiveness and healing in a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.”Ok, he had a momentary setback when “he entered and was discovered in a homosexual bar,” but overall he is happily married to a former lesbian and has two beautiful children. Which clearly proves that other gays can find Jesus and straighten up! Joy to the world! (Sing it.)
But on to our larger topic, nipping ‘em in the bud.There are at least five things to look for, although just learning two should be enough to give you the idea (James cites and draws heavily on a book by Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D., Preventing Homosexuality: A Parent’s Guide, which he hails as “the most insightful material available on the subject”):
1) Does your kid repeatedly state a desire to be, or insist that he is, the other sex? That is to say, does your son tell you he’s gay? If so, that is one good indicator that he is—or rather, wants to be, according to these fonts of wisdom on child-rearing (no pun intended).
2) Does your young boy have a preference for cross-dressing, or simulating female attire? If so, you should seek counseling. But only from one of the two recommended agencies on James’ list, or someone who shares your “Christian belief that homosexuality is sinful and can be undone.”
Geery lived off the grid for 15 years in an earth-sheltered, solar heated home, while his kids learned in school that solar energy isn't feasible. NAPTA hosts a page on Geery's foibles in education, and explains how he got his butt fired from a tenured teaching position. Here's a short clip of his most recent solar contraption; for more on that project, and Geery's contention that the Wright Brothers took a wrong turn, please visit his airship page (hyperblimp.com). Apparently, Geery is the only one in the world to respond to Osama bin Laden, call bullshit on him and George together, and expose them for the pansy ass rich kids that they are. Unfortunately, bin Laden has been too scared to write back and explain himsself; and George is still working hard to finish his goat book.
Being born andd raised in the atheistic/communist country I would say that not only homosequals were despised and persecuted there but also there was a law against them. Does that mean that it was under the Saviour's protection andd maybe Dr. Dobson is a communist at heart?
by
Mark Sashine (47 articles, 19 quicklinks, 235 diaries, 3362 comments)
on Tuesday, November 13, 2007 at 12:56:26 PM
my other half tells me I use the word too much. She says I should find other words. But these right wing decerbrates are a pox upon humanity, with their hate and intolerance. Is it tolerant to not tolerate intolerance? It would be fine, and I wouldn't care what they though if only they didn't try to force their beliefs on the rest of us. Despicable. That's another word I find I overuse. Or use just enough.
by
Rob Kall (762 articles, 3850 quicklinks, 321 diaries, 1642 comments)
on Tuesday, November 13, 2007 at 8:49:51 PM
Dobson is stating his opinion. You just happen to disagree with him.
Hate is a rather strong word , don't you think? And don't you think homophobe is a rather over used cliche? Homophobe: a fear of homosexuals. No one fears them. Christians don't hate homosexuals, we just think that homosexuality is not the natural order of things. God didn't
create homosexuals. Inherited sin is not a far off concept as many of you
believe. People inherit high cholesterol, heart defects, etc. As humans we admit we are not perfect and inherit imperfections. Whether it is our fault
or not it is still is an imperfection.
by
Bob Gormley (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 914 comments)
on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 at 9:10:43 AM
Which language? Whose rewrite? Whose interpretation are you talking about?
I would encourge you to do some howework with an open mind, as I believe most of the rest of us here have done. If God gave you anything that you need to develop and use most, it is your mind.
Have you actually read the article below yet? I believe we talked about this some time ago. The author of it is always eager to hear contrary views, but it seems most readers are too lazy to give it enough thought to respond.
Just like with any writing done hundreds or thousands of years ago, originally in another language, one can interpret such text in virtually any manner they want. I saw an article not long ago where someone was making an excellent case that the bible strongly supported homosexuality.
But so what? Faith is not science. And science is an extension of logic, dealing with observations rational people can agree on, or rationally argue over and further study to find answers. Faith is what one choses to believe. And it certainly seems to me that Dobson is taking great liberty with his faith, when he pontificates in a series of books how others should think--particularly when those folks are generally uneducated, trapped in preconceived religious beliefs, and seeking real guidance.
Meanwhile, I would love to hear your thought out responses to my friend, Deana Jensen's, Godwho article:
As to how we'd procreate if everyone were homosexual, a) homosexuals can and do have kids, as even Dobson pointed out, and as a friend of mine proved, with two girls; b) there are now technological means for this; c) of what relevance is your question, any more than asking if everyone decided not to have kids--as so many people do decide?
by
Daniel Geery (26 articles, 58 quicklinks, 121 diaries, 681 comments)
on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 at 9:33:13 AM
I read the entire article. I do have an open mind.Please don't imply that my
comments are strictly a knee-jerk reaction.
I have been to many other websites which give both the pros and cons of
homosexuality.I have listened to homosexuals tell their side of the story. I just have made my decision that homosexuality is not the
way nature intended. I know people that have turned homosexual because
of emotional reasons. Some are born that way. Did you ever ask the question why they are born that way?You claim I don't have an open mind, but I'm willing to
exchange ideas on a forum that ir predominantly in acceptance of the homosexual lifestyle. Are you willing to do that?
I don't apologize to a website which sings the praises of homosexuality,
and blasphemes the very God which created them. I don't think a man fucking another man in the ass is natural, do you? Sorry for the strong language, but it makes my point.
What God, what interpretation, you say? I say the God which is above all
Gods, whether you call him Jesus, Jehovah, Buddha or whatever. By the way, many religions recognize the perverted nature of homosexuality, not
just the Bible. One doesn't even need the Bible to form an opinion about
homosexuality.
Yeah, we probably had similar discussion about this before, and I am well aware of how you view my comments. It's a free country so you're welcome to it.
My opinions are not based on a Bible-thumping, brainwashing pastor, but are my own opinions.
Do you cringe when you see two homosexual men kiss ach other in public? Be honest, don't you find it just a bit strange? Even kids know it's
weird.
by
Bob Gormley (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 914 comments)
on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 at 10:08:12 AM
Do you cringe when you see a black man and a white woman kiss each other in public? Be honest, don't you find it just a bit strange? Even kids know it's weird.
Seems to me your gut reaction to two men kissing is the same as back before civil rights were given (sort of) to blacks. Were white's gut reactions proof that they were correct? Seems the bible did a good job of supporting the gut reaction that blacks were non-human.
by
disillusioneddemocrat (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 1 comments)
on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 at 5:04:41 PM
I reread the article, and not to my surprise it tries to minimize God and maximize nature. No need to argue here.... I know your perspective on things,
and you know mine. In a nutshell I make God the center of my universe, and
you make humanity/nature the center of your universe.
How one cannot believe in God is beyond me, but that's just me. Just realizing that I exist I know that there is a power greater than myself.
Did I come into being out of thin air? By some miraculous random series of
events I evolved from a single celled amoeba into homo erectus? How do you explain such abstract concepts as the mind, emotions, intellect, etc.?
I can accept differences of opinion.... but what irks me the most is when
people imply I don't use my mind because I believe in a God. My IQ is well above normal, bordering genius level... not that I put much stock into those
tests. But for you scientific minded folks you can relate to numbers better than intuition.
And by the way, I am an electrical engineer who finds no conflict between
science and God. God actually created science.
Yeah.... There is a a lot of religious crap out there, no doubt.
Much hypocrisy, no doubt. Sheep in wolves clothing, no doubt.
But... God remains the same.
Humble yourself, maybe you'll find what many others have found.
by
Bob Gormley (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 914 comments)
on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 at 7:43:29 PM
So, would your Christ reject homosexuals, paint them to be evil, and assure them of eternal punishment whilst healing the lepers and associating with prostitutes and others of questionable morals/character?
People DO fear homosexuals just like they fear other races and creeds...
Your G*d should have given you the wisdom to evolve from some of the more ridiculous paths of thinking such as those expoused in Leviticus and opened your hearts and minds to embrace modern discoveries and revelations in thinking that I would suppose G*d gave to us for a reason...
Or shall we stone them to death and see who gets to 'hell' first?
by
C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 647 comments)
on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 at 9:47:34 AM
but you didn't address the point I was trying to make about 'evolved' thinking and some of the more antiquated 'laws' of religious dogma...
Surely this 'higher authority' wants us to use the brains he gave us and to build upon knowledge rather than refer to dusty old books with outdated concepts? We've come a long way from thinking that the plague was G*d's punishment haven't we? Must we continue to indulge in worn out bigotry and it's baseless claims?
by
C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 647 comments)
on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 at 10:57:57 AM
I'll agree with you on that, however -if we find that stoning to death to be a repulsive form of punishment these days, wouldn't it make sense to re-evaluate our list of 'punishable offenses' or 'sins'? I understand that there are some things that the Christian Church (in general) is fairly un-wavering on, but some denominations or 'flavors' have accepted homosexuality and not placed it as a stumbling block wherewith to exclude persons from the religious experience inside their churches... If you'll agree that not all homosexuals make a concious choice to have that particular inclination, then it seems to me that the line of thinking must conclude that G*d wouldn't create a race or section of the population that was 'doomed from the start' would he? The notion of Original Sin wasn't always with us but it's fine if you also believe that... Why is it that you can't update your thinking in light of the modern world and all of it's discoveries? It's the same kind of thinking that is stifling Brain Stem Cells research and usage of new technologies... I'll just never understand why some of us get our panties in a bunch if you happen to see same sex couples kissing or holding hands. Personally, I get physically ill when I see elitist hypocritical scum parading around with 'W -The President' and 'Jesus is Lord' stickers on their SUVs and flag pins on their lapels...
It tends to remind me of a very telling photograph from the AP in the newspaper at the beginning of the war... one that had a soldier (so the caption read) reading his Bible during some 'downtime' while across his helmet was written: Kill 'Em All, Let Allah Sort 'Em Out...
by
C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 647 comments)
on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 at 11:40:22 AM
I was trying to make...that the killing of gays by states such as Iran, justified by their views of religion using antiquated concepts of justice are not that far from the reasoning that we deny gays in this country basic civil rights, such as not protecting them from housing and employment discrimination based solely on their sexual preference. If Bob Gormley were to decide that he did not want to be served by the gay waiter at Pizzeria UNO and were to complain to the management, it would be perfectly legal to fire that waiter from his job. He may then be unable to pay his rent and be forced to find another place to live and be turned away, legally, just because he is gay.
Is this justified? Is this right? How different is this from stoning him to death?
by
ingiro (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 45 comments)
on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 at 11:56:17 AM
Antiquated thinking is the root of the problem, failure for one's own thoughts to evolve beyond outdated concepts results in mass misery, death, and state and church sanctioned hate -pure and simple!
Blind faith... like the heffer to the slaughter...
by
C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 647 comments)
on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 at 12:08:36 PM
I can adjust my thinking on certain things, but some things are immutable.
Even Jesus updated certain things in his day. Divorce was allowed in the
Old Testament (because of the hardness of men's hearts), but he forbade
it in the Old Testament. The Pharisees and Sadducces were hung up on
keeping the Sabbath day holy at all costs (like no work of any kind). Jesus
explained to them that the Sabbath was made for man's sake (because of
the need for rest and rejuvenation of the body), but things could be allowed
that were for the greater good.
As for stoning this was acceptable practice in Old Testament times. But..
Jesus also refined this idea, ie "Let he that is without sin cast the first stone."
So there is room for flexibility and one does not have to adhere to strict dogma.
The key is to do whatever is constructive and upbuilding. I don't believe
God accepts "homosexuality" as an OK thing. I do believe He has compassion in the sense that He wants us to stop something like this before we destroy ourselves.
by
Bob Gormley (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 914 comments)
on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 at 12:00:01 PM
I can adjust my thinking on certain things, but some things are immutable.
Even Jesus updated certain things in his day. Divorce was allowed in the
Old Testament (because of the hardness of men's hearts), but he forbade
it in the Old Testament. The Pharisees and Sadducces were hung up on
keeping the Sabbath day holy at all costs (like no work of any kind). Jesus
explained to them that the Sabbath was made for man's sake (because of
the need for rest and rejuvenation of the body), but things could be allowed
that were for the greater good.
As for stoning this was acceptable practice in Old Testament times. But..
Jesus also refined this idea, ie "Let he that is without sin cast the first stone."
So there is room for flexibility and one does not have to adhere to strict dogma.
The key is to do whatever is constructive and upbuilding. I don't believe
God accepts "homosexuality" as an OK thing. I do believe He has compassion in the sense that He wants us to stop something like this before we destroy ourselves.
by
Bob Gormley (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 3 diaries, 914 comments)
on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 at 12:00:13 PM
