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September 1, 2007 at 14:14:53
by Anthony Wade Page 1 of 1 page(s) |
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September 1, 2007 While we are constantly distracted by the corporate media to believe that things like the Don Imus stupidity amounts to proof that racism is alive and well in America, real racism goes on unmolested and unreported. It is a shame that in 21st century America, we have made very little progress on matter of equality and race. Hundreds of years have produced many positive changes in the country and precious little change in the hearts of people who harbor hate toward other human beings because they are simply different. If you want to see true racism, I direct you to Jena, Louisiana. In Jena, things like Don Imus are just silly things folks up north banter about while the true practice of racism is continually perfected. In a community that is 85% white there exists a High School where a popular shade tree had an unwritten “whites only” rule. That’s right America, at a public high school in Jena, Louisiana there was a shade tree that blacks were not allowed to sit under. Not a school code, just a communal understanding that whites have preference over blacks. So much was this an understanding at the school that a black student asked permission from the school to sit under the tree. The response the next day were three nooses, in the school colors, were hanging from the tree to greet the student who dared to question racism. Undeterred, black students went and sat under the tree. The students who hung the nooses were suspended and the administration chalked it up to a prank. That is what hanging nooses amounts to in the dirty south, a prank. Never mind the history of those who died at the end of nooses fighting for the freedoms that we are all supposed to be endowed with by our Creator. A prank. What ensued was an outbreak of fights and unrest at the high school and quite frankly, understandably so. The community responded by sending the District Attorney out to the school, to address the black students. Not to talk to the white students, just the black students. As if that was not offensive enough the direct quote being attributed to the District Attorney toward the black students at this meeting was; “I can end your lives with a stroke of the pen.” Things continued to escalate in Jena as both sides continued their aggression. Black students were assaulted at white parties and three black teens accused a white man of pulling a shotgun on them in the parking lot of a convenience store. This all culminated with an assault by six black teens on a white teen as the result of a fight. The community’s response was to charge the six teens with attempted murder. 
Never mind that the “assaulted” white teen was released from the hospital the same day and was seen at a social event later that day having no ill effects from the “attack.” Never mind that a few nights earlier a friend of one of the black teens had his skull opened by a broken bottle and the white assailant in that case was merely charged with “simple battery”; a misdemeanor. No, these six were charged with attempted murder. The first of the “Jena Six” went to trial where the charges were reduced to “aggravated battery”. In order for that to be the charge there needed to be a weapon. The weapon in this case? Tennis shoes. I kid you not. The black youth was defended by a public defender who called no witnesses on his behalf and the all-white jury convicted 17-year old Mychal Bell, who now awaits sentencing where he faces 22 years in jail for fighting with the deadly weapon of tennis shoes.
There are five more of the “Jena Six” awaiting trial, rotting away in prison. They are still charged with attempted murder, so the bails could be set to a level that the families could not bail them out. Jordan Flaherty, the independent journalist who brought this story to the national stage understands what is really going on in Jena, “I don't think there is anyone around that would doubt that if this had been a fight between black students or a fight of white students beating up a black student, you would never be seeing this. It's completely about race. It's completely about two systems of justice."
I do not like using terms like the “dirty south” but this story is simply filthy. It speaks to our souls about who we are as a people. We like to think that we have advanced and progressed but every now and again there is a story like this one that should make you sick to your stomach. I know there is little we can do about bigots and racists. They will always be with us no matter how much we think we have grown as a people. What needs to be absolutely intolerable however is to have that bigotry and racism pervade our governmental systems. Justice is supposed to be blind and that includes color blind. The people of Jena should be ashamed of the taint they have brought to the national landscape. The larger issue remains though the people in positions of power who apparently not only support the inherent racism and bigotry but also drive it. The higher levels of government need to step in and correct this situation immediately. The District Attorney should be fired just for the threat he made to the high school students. Instead, he has kept to his word and is trying to end the lives of six youth with the stroke of his pen. The Public Defender should be fired and disbarred for not representing his client appropriately. Hopefully the judge will come to his senses before sentencing and begins to reverse this horrific trend of injustice.
I do not hold out much hope though for justice in Jena. Somewhere six kids are in jail facing the obliteration of their lives for having a schoolyard fight, where no one was hurt. Somewhere there is a white community that is embracing this instead of being repulsed. Somewhere in America, racism is alive and well.
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Where is the media?
Where is the lamestream media on cases like this? Just a little national attention could help alot. by Anthony Wade (160 articles, 2 quicklinks, 44 diaries, 890 comments [19 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Saturday, Sep 1, 2007 at 3:45:32 PM  (0+)
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Good article, Anthony. But -you're wrong.
I live here in the South and it's never going to change... If we have a media that's complicit in cheerleading the march to an illegal war by a group of criminals who were practically abetted by the press in their takeover of our nation -why would any of them care about six black kids being victimized by racial taunts and threats??? From what I think I know about the case, and I may be completely wrong about this, the attempted murder charge comes from the black teen(s) continuing to assault the white kid after he was knocked completely unconscious (thus absolutely defenseless and possibly already dead?)... Seems like a fairly legitimate charge to me -regardless of color. I think you've simplified matters to a bit of an extreme... not that I think the white kids are worth defending to any degree whatsoever but the battered youth in question was (to my knowledge) attacked by the group and not the other way around. You commit an act of violence and you face the consequences... it's a gamble anytime. They easily could have killed him. The school officials should lose their jobs over the way they handled the whole thing to begin with... The D.A. as well -for his remarks. The double standard, as you pointed out, is quite obvious... You should be mad that justice is not served in regards to that instead of angry at the fact that those six teens broke the law and will have to answer for it... On the other hand, Genarlow Wilson still sits in prison here in Georgia -serving ten years for consensual oral sex with a 15 year old when he was 17 years of age... Rich white men don't wind up in jail much... Poor people rarely see justice... Low-income black men are scarcely treated to even equality let alone justice... But that doesn't mean those teens had any validation or justification in their violence as I understand it... I can understand their provocation and desires -but that don't make it right... There's honestly no way to defend their actions. Sorry. by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Saturday, Sep 1, 2007 at 5:14:14 PM (1+)
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Reply: Well
I am not sure where your facts are coming from but i read all i could find on this case: "From what I think I know about the case, and I may be completely wrong about this, the attempted murder charge comes from the black teen(s) continuing to assault the white kid after he was knocked completely unconscious (thus absolutely defenseless and possibly already dead?)... " SO THE GUY IS ALMOST DEAD AND YOU KNOW HE WAS UNCONSCIOUS, YET HE WAS RELEASED THE SAME DAY AND SEEN AT A PARTY LATER THAT EVENING? tHAT DOESNT ADD UP FOR ME, SORRY. "Seems like a fairly legitimate charge to me -regardless of color." eXCEPT YOUR FACTS ARE WRONG. "I think you've simplified matters to a bit of an extreme... not that I think the white kids are worth defending to any degree whatsoever but the battered youth in question was (to my knowledge) attacked by the group and not the other way around. You commit an act of violence and you face the consequences... it's a gamble anytime. They easily could have killed him." PLEASE, POST A LINK THAT SUPPORTS THIS NOTION BECAUSE I HAVENT SEEN IT AT ALL. "You should be mad that justice is not served in regards to that instead of angry at the fact that those six teens broke the law and will have to answer for it..." BY NO STRETCH DO I THINK THEY SHOULD NOT FACE CONSEQUENCES, I AM TALKING ABOUT JUSTICE. DO YOU THINK THAT 20 YEARS IS FAIR FOR A SCHOOLYARD FIGHT WHERE NO ONE GOT HURT??? CMON, BE REAL. "But that doesn't mean those teens had any validation or justification in their violence as I understand it..." YOU MISSED THE ENTIRE POIINT OF THE ARTICLE AND READ IT FOR SOMETHING IT WAS NOT. bESIDES THAT, YOU ARE MISTAKEN ABOUT THE NATURE OF THE BEAT DOWN FROM WHAT I READ. "i can understand their provocation and desires -but that don't make it right... There's honestly no way to defend their actions." THE BACKDROP STORY IS PROVIDED FOR CONTEXT BECAUSE WITHOUT THE CONTEXT NO ONE UNDERSTANDS WHY THE FIGHT OCCURED AT ALL. REGARDLESS, THE ISSUE IS THE RACISM IN THE SYSTEM THAT TAKES A SCHOOLYARD FIGHT AND SEEKS TO DESTROY THE LIVES OF SIX YOUTH BECAUSE OF THEIR COLOR. TO DENY THAT IS SIMPLY BLIND. AW by Anthony Wade (160 articles, 2 quicklinks, 44 diaries, 890 comments [19 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Saturday, Sep 1, 2007 at 5:24:36 PM (0+)
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diversion tactics
anthony asks a question, "where's the media?" and i think that needs to be addressed. the above response where the reader detours the story about the media and the iraq war or other cases and then to goes on to say that a kid who was treated and released and out socializing later that night was close to death seems absurd and a detour from the reality of the situation. i was on south street in philly a few weeks ago and a fist fight broke out. i guarantee those guys aren't sitting in a jail somewhere. this is exactly the kind of story we read about from 50 years ago that we would say, "shame, shame, thank God times have changed." well, they haven't and if the mainstream media has time to put in their headlines crap about whether britney spears' ass is showing, they can certainly take the time to, even as objectively as possible, bring this story to light as a serious social issue that needs to be addressed. by Cheryl Biren-Wright (30 articles, 42 quicklinks, 8 diaries, 485 comments [8 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Saturday, Sep 1, 2007 at 6:01:06 PM (0+)
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Reply: Exactly
I was not there so i can only go by what is being barely reported by the alternative press. Perhaps if an Olbermann did a segmant on it we could get more specifics. Either way, it certainly doesn't sound like justice to me. by Anthony Wade (160 articles, 2 quicklinks, 44 diaries, 890 comments [19 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Saturday, Sep 1, 2007 at 6:41:33 PM (0+)
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Reply: READ WHAT I SAID AGAIN
I NEVER CLAIMED THE KID WAS ALMOST DEAD... A LITTLE READING COMPREHENSION??? INITIALLY, I WAS ON YOUR SIDE... NOT DETOURING, BUT MAKING THE POINT THAT THE MEDIA ISN'T GOING TO CARE ABOUT JUSTICE FOR ANYONE -LET ALONE SIX BLACK KIDS FROM LOW INCOME FAMILIES IN LA! GEEZ... NO THEY WON'T GET JUSTICE. NEITHER WILL GENARLOW. BUT THE JENA 6 HAVE EVEN LESS COVERAGE THAN G. WILSON AND A FEW EXTRA THINGS WORKING AGAINST THEM SUCH AS BELL'S FOUR PRIOR CHARGES (TWO OF WHICH ARE FOR ASSAULT) AND HIS PROBATION VIOLATIONS -OF WHICH, THE FIGHT WAS ONE! EVEN WITH A CHANGE OF VENUE, HE WOULD HAVE BEEN SCREWED!!! CNN DID AN ADEQUATE JOB FILLING IN THE BACKSTORY AS WELL AND GAVE DETAILS IN THEIR INITIAL NEWSCAST SEGMENT STATING THAT ALL OF THE DEFENDANTS WERE CHARGED WITH ASSAULTING THE WHITE KID, SEVERAL OF THEM STEPPING OUT OF THE CROWD AND ATTACKING THE UNCONSCIOUS BOY AS HE LAY ON THE GROUND WITH A CONCUSSION... HE WAS TREATED AND RELEASED FROM THE HOSPITAL. MORE TO COME. G*DDAMN. by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 1:58:05 AM (0+)
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Racism, alive and well...
thank you, Anthony. I've been following the case of the Jena Six and it is as you've reported -- blatant racism, at its finest. I've also been following the story of Genarlow Wilson; let us not forget yet another black teen in the south, that has been falsely accused of a serious crime, and has been sitting in prison now for some 2.5 years. The crime? At age 17, having consensual oral sex with his 15 year old girlfriend. I've also written about Kenneth Foster Jr. - who, under the Texas Law of Parties, was to be executed last Thursday for a crime he didn't commit. Shockingly enough, only hours before his execution, he was given life imprisonment. And there's the dubious conviction of Troy Anthony Davis, also on death row. The list goes on and on. Sadly, it is not just in the south, although it seems to be festering there, if not thriving. I've seen it firsthand in many places around the country while accompanied by a black friend. It is heartbreaking that in 2007, with war, poverty, disease, starvation, and a host of other horrors, that we still expend so much time and energy in hating anyone seen as different - which translates to an illogical fear of the perceived "other" -- and a nationwide paranoia that George Bush has continued to instill, and to perfection. Thank you for writing on behalf of the Jena 6. Jan by Jan Baumgartner (60 articles, 148 quicklinks, 12 diaries, 311 comments [12 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Saturday, Sep 1, 2007 at 6:58:52 PM (0+)
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Reply: You are welcome
Unfortunately, i have not heard of the other cases either. Our media has failed us so egregiously, they are accomplices to the downfall of society. by Anthony Wade (160 articles, 2 quicklinks, 44 diaries, 890 comments [19 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Saturday, Sep 1, 2007 at 7:03:45 PM (0+)
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Reply: north/south
jan makes a good point that it is not just limited to the south. the buildup to the story "a white tree" does have the haunting sound of the old south, but clearly injustices happen in every state north or south as i'm sure anthony knows anyway. while i am familiar with the stories jan mentions it's no thanks to the media. you truly need to be connected with certain groups/organizations or fair press forums to know about these in any depth. (although i do think genarlow wilson's story has been featured in primetime on major networks). but, i write all this to tell anthony that last week i attended a major rally in newark new jersey. THE most diverse rally i have ever been to in my life and deliberately so. one of the issues addressed was police brutality against minorities which is definitely a well-known problem up "north." i would like you to know, though, anthony that there were many, many signs and t-shirts that read "Free the Jena 6." again, no thanks to the lamestream media. thanks for doing their job. by Cheryl Biren-Wright (30 articles, 42 quicklinks, 8 diaries, 485 comments [8 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Saturday, Sep 1, 2007 at 7:26:52 PM (0+)
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No Link but here's an article...
JENA, LA - August 29 Aug 29, 2007 07:28 AM EST by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 2:24:07 AM (0+)
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Firstly...
...the media is currently engaged in telling us that Britney spears is an unfit mother, as if that's somehow news. I thought so when I saw the picture of her driving with her kid between herself and the steering wheel. A steering wheel which contains an explosive device commonly known as an airbag. Uh DUH!! Secondly, racism IS NOT the sole property of the south, dirty or otherwise. As a matter of fact, for many years, Ohio boasted the largest number of Klan members. Trust me, the Klan is active in Ohio! They may not be lynching, but you can bet there are crosses burning on warm summer nights in Out-in-the-boonies, Ohio. They even showed up on the steps of the Lucas County Courthouse one summer. I drove by just to see it for myself. There they were, in all their "glory". It peaceful for the most part, but as you might expect, the racial epithets were flying like mosquitoes around a stagnant pond. And as much as I hate to say it, racism will always exist. It's an inescapable reality. The only way it will ever go away is when the day comes that there is no visually discernible color or racial differences in humans. In other words, sometime about a millennium or so down the road...if then. We are a slow species to evolve, either genetically or socially. The day may well dawn when things like race, sex, or sexual identity don't have meaning. Until that day comes, we are what we are, where we are, who we are, and how we are. Blessed be! by Pappy (61 articles, 0 quicklinks, 11 diaries, 860 comments [5 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 2:54:12 AM (0+)
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Despicable
Right wingers, racism, injustice... they're all despicable. I could write a book about it. Here's an excellent article from truthout to supplement Anthony's excellent article. The people of Jena are beneath contempt. To start off with, David Duke won a majority there, and in the whole parish they live in. These redneck neanderthals are hereditary abusers or neglecters of democracy. Imagine over 230 years and the cretins of Jena still operate in such a hateful way. While the lamestream media obsess over an ugly aging right wing gay hypocrite in denial (ugly in character and spirit,) wasting hour after our, recycling the same images an sound bites, most of which the make up from their own paid personnel, the real stories, far more moving, far more important, are ignored. Yet, it is said this is not a simple story. The 16 year old victim of the crimes of the justice system of Jena has a record. He violated parole. We have to wonder what justice gone astray was involved in his previous relations with the courts of Jena, tainted as we now know they are. The real crime in Jena is against justice. The criminals are being paid as agents of the law. THEY should be charged, tried and jailed. by Rob Kall (953 articles, 4178 quicklinks, 374 diaries, 2087 comments [45 recommended, 3 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 4:15:10 AM (0+)
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Reply: Excuse me?
"These redneck neanderthals are hereditary abusers or neglecters of democracy. Imagine over 230 years and the cretins of Jena still operate in such a hateful way." In case you didn't know, "redneck neanderthal" is a very offensive term to us southerners. We southerners feel that we are negatively sterotyped, thrown in together and all equally considered as some subhuman species by northerners. Consider our offense at such terms in the same way you find "Zionist" and "Islamofascist" objectionable. We also resent any insuination that we are inbred idiots or cretins. Our perceptions are that northerners - or should I say yankees - believe that if only southerners were eliminated all the ills in America would vanish. [Since bashing southerners appears ok at OpEd news, I must assume I can bash northerners. So here's a yankee joke: How did you get a yankee to eat grits? Call them polenta, charge ten dollars and act snotty when you serve them.] MSM has portrayed us all as ignorant blood-thristy lazy scheming sexpot lynching racist homophobic burdens to civilization. Hell, Hollywood has portrayed us as so stupid and simplistic that they have had Yankee actors for decades doing horrible imitations of the the dozens of southern dialects grossly characterized as constituting a single southern accent. All the south is seen as filthy and corrupt, and to be quite honest, it is chauvinistic bigotry and prejudice that would be decried as hate speech if directed toward other groups. But somehow, even among people calling themselves liberal, even people like Bill Maher feel perfectly justified to engage in invoking negative stereotypes, prejudice and bigotry against southerners. How ironic and truly, truly lamentable that there is so much bigotry from people who denounce bigotry. When the conservatives I know here in the most culturally and ethically diverse rural community in the United States hear such remarks about rednecks and the dirty south they typically say something like, "yep, just like liberals. Tolerate anybody and love anybody but us. It's politically correct to hate southerners." What a shame I can't often argue to the contrary to my neighbors. Hate speech is hate speech is hate speech. by Richard Mathis (132 articles, 111 quicklinks, 5 diaries, 120 comments) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 7:29:28 PM (0+)
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Reply: thanks mathis...
for broaching something that i have noticed here on oped. southern bashing. it would appear that rob and the staff have a distinctive blind spot for this. by k kelly (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 1 diaries, 182 comments) on Tuesday, Sep 4, 2007 at 5:48:33 AM (0+)
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Reply: Rob,
As far as I know, nobody has claimed that there was any justice that went astray in Mr. Bell's previous charges have they? Are we just to assume he's just one of many victims of the world and has gotten a bum deal because he's black? That seems to be what you're implying, no? Just because the present case has some serious racial overtones to it are we to believe that even his initial charges are somehow part of a vast conspiracy to jail law abiding black citizens in Jena? Shame on you. by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 10:50:04 PM (0+)
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Reply: Cagey.
Get lost. You're an idiot. What in f*ck's name do communists and socialists have to do with this? Aren't you missing some really important militia meeting right now? by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Monday, Sep 3, 2007 at 6:37:14 AM (0+)
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REPLY TO CROWBAIT
Even if the Black 16 year old participated in an assault on a white teen that knocked him unconcious and gave him a concussion was on probation for "priors," the fact that the white teen was out of the hospital and at a party three hours later means that a 22 year prison sentence is grossly disproportionate. In fact, this kind of "justice" in Jena is despicable and the people of Jena should be ashamed of themselves. In fact if the pressure from around the country is not able to prevent this kind of "justice," hopefully enough people will show up in Jena from around the country to nullify such a travesty of justice by extra judicial means. Robert Halfhill by rhalfhill (3 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 326 comments [1 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 7:10:04 AM (0+)
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Reply: Yes, I understand your point... ad nauseum
But there is a standard the courts go by and that is why there are limitations as to sentencing per the charges. There's no question that racism has played and continues to play the main role in what transpired down there and what Rob said is much more to the point that should be addressed -prior failings of the system that have lead to this horrible situation for the six youths now charged, especially Bell... But you guys are continually seeking to justify the means by the ends... "O well, the kid was in and out of the ER... he only had a concussion anyway... he deserved it... he was out partying later (at a school function)... THAT MEANS THEY DIDN'T MEAN TO F*** HIM UP TOO BAD..." It doesn't work that way in any court of law, otherwise the charge of Manslaughter wouldn't exist! Carry on... by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 11:56:13 AM (0+)
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excess population
an article the other day discussing ecology vs capitalism expressed some of my feelings quite well. capitalism sees people as commodities. there are too many people in this country today as far as the 'capitalist' class is concerned. therefore, they seek to rid the country of this excess. african-american people have always been considered peripheral by these controlling elites. today these people and poor people serve only as cannon fodder or pawns to create the prison-industrial complex which makes fortunes for the haliburtons and keeps whites, who would be otherwise unemployed, working. capitalism is about power, not people. there is only one underlying philosophical rubric for capitalism: the belief in money and power by any means necessary. humanism is not a value to be admired and supported. i recall years ago being accused of being a bleeding heart because i chose to work with poor women rather than move up the ladder into a political paper pushing job. this from a white male heading a CETA job training program. he made it very clear where his values were and this is what we are facing all the time. as a consequence we have the jena 6 and genarlow wilson and mumia on death row since the early '80's and the many, many other cases of inhumane justice. if the people of this country don't raise hell over these cases and the continued direction of this country, things will only get worse. i am reminded of the poem by a catholic priest during wwII, which many of you may know. it talked about how they came for the jews but i did nothing; they came for the labor unionists and i did nothing; etc, and when they came for me, there was noone left.' i am not quoting, but the idea is clear. by tanya (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 37 comments) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 8:01:11 AM (0+)
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well
Pappy - i never said it was only in the south, this case was in the south. At the end i even say, "somewhere in America." Crowbait - i am not sure what your agenda is here but it does not appear to be the truth. You are the one trying to change this discussion into one of excuse making, not I. I have never adiocated that they should not be charged with something. The entire point is that they over charged the six kids. Anyone without an agenda can see that. I would speculate that they overcharged them on purpose to ensure they could not post bail and so they could send a message to the black community. My article primarily was about the injustice in the charges, not in defending the actions. But context is important. I also primarily did call for the real culprits, the officials practicing racism to be held to account so once again, your motives for distorting my point remains unclear. Rob - thanks for the link AW by Anthony Wade (160 articles, 2 quicklinks, 44 diaries, 890 comments [19 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 5:59:30 PM (0+)
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wow
I just read the Truthout piece. It is even worse than i had thought. I do not know how anyone can read this objectively and not feel shame for what is happening to these kids. AW. by Anthony Wade (160 articles, 2 quicklinks, 44 diaries, 890 comments [19 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 6:13:49 PM (0+)
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No agenda, Anthony...
As I already said, I thought it was a good article. You are the one that seemed to over-simplify and make the excuse that they were over charged... I think not. Then you call into question my understanding of the crime and dispute what the court documents state. I've been a strong supporter of Civil Rights and championed against racism my entire life (even going so far as to have taken a knife in the stomach and subsequently having blinded the lousy skinheaded sh*tbag that did it only to have been charged, myself, with Attempted Murder among other things...). So, I've clearly learned that anytime you commit an act of violence you must be prepared to face the consequences even if they aren't quite what you'd think they should have ended up being... Hit a kid in the back of the head and then proceed to stomp and kick the sh*t out of him while he's unconscious and you run a great likelyhood that you're going to be charged with attempted murder... I don't care what color you are!!!! It has nothing to do with white/black. So if they'd killed the young man and were charged with murder -would that be racism? Or how about if the kid had died and they'd been charged with manslaughter? Racism? Get a flippin' grip... and have a dose of the reality that is the legal system. By the way, glad I could clear up the details for you with the article from the 'alternative press' that goes by the name Associated Press... seems to have contradicted you a bit, eh? by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 7:32:25 PM (0+)
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Reply: BTW Sorry for the snide remark...
We're probably not going to change either one's mind on the whole matter anyway -though I do side with you on a great deal of it... it's just the details and the accusation of myself having an agenda because I'm not goose-stepping with the rest of OpEd on this one -that we disagree on. That and you telling me that I had the facts wrong and not conceding that it was YOU who had the facts wrong after I pasted the AP article... There are facts and matters of opinion (which we both clearly have on this incredibly hot-button issue) -but there are also standards by which the courts operate that specify sentencing protocol strictly along the lines of charges filed regardless of the defendant's color... 2nd Degree Assault is a reduced charge from Attempted Murder and needn't (in the case of reduction) be a charge in strict accordance with the original charge -if you understand what I'm saying? THERE INDEED IS A DOUBLE STANDARD, THOUGH!!!! And the bail being set so high was probably racially motivated as well. However, violations of parole or probation generally result in immediate incarceration of the defendant and his serving of the full extent of his offset prison time for the crimes of which he was first convicted -which is not racism, obviously. But, the claim of excessive punishment based strictly on the end result of the boy's injuries completely neglects the notion of Intent. Can you see what I'M saying? Respectfully, Bid by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 8:46:54 PM (0+)
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and...
Pappy - i never said it was only in the south, this case was in the south. At the end i even say, "somewhere in America." No, you just called the article "Racism In The Dirty South," and in doing so, you made an implication that racism is the sole property of those who live below the Mason-Dixon line. Being a transplanted yankee, and a naturalized Texan, I also find the use of "redneck Neanderthal" to be offensive. Some of my best friends are redneck Neanderthals. Some of them are racist, most are not. Funny, it's pretty much the same distribution as it was when I was living in Toledo, Ohio. Racism is going to be with us until there are no more racial differences. Even if racism were to miraculously disappear tomorrow, there would be other "isms" waiting in the wings to take its place. We are too close to our primate relatives to avoid being overstimulated by the purple monkeys among us. if racism were to go away, there would still be ageism, weight-ism, and good old sexism. If those were to go away, then there would be religi-ism, xenophobia, and good old homophobia. Humanity has a long way to go to see the Utopian ideal of which you speak. As far as the crime committed in Jena, Louisiana, it's a sad thing indeed. One would think that in the 21st century, such inane stupidity would have been eradicated. However, is this crime any worse than the one committed by the religious fucks that killed gay man Matthew Shepard in Wyoming? He actually died. In the Jena case, apparently those charged were actually doing something illegal. Maybe it wasn't as severe as attempted murder, but violence begets violence, and if they had just walked away, they wouldn't have charges pending, would they? I understand your outrage. Clearly this case shows us that the ideal and the reality that make up life in America are far away from each other. I'd love to see the day that the ideal and the reality overlap, but I'll be long dead before that happens. Blessed be! by Pappy (61 articles, 0 quicklinks, 11 diaries, 860 comments [5 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 9:29:00 PM (1+)
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Reply: Toledo
I am from the south but have lived elsewhere. I never even heard certain racist words referring to Jews, Hispanics and Poles until I went up north as a child to visit family. Nor had I met Nazi sympathizers until a visit to Toledo back in the late 70's. Then I met a couple of pro-Nazis who were also big time pot heads and abused cocaine. Did I mention that they were cops smoking dope and tooting coke they had seized off blacks they had busted? I will say it again: hate speech is hate speech is hate speech. by Richard Mathis (132 articles, 111 quicklinks, 5 diaries, 120 comments) on Monday, Sep 3, 2007 at 9:01:05 AM (0+)
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Thank You, Pappy
I feel very much the same way. And you made the point also, the one that I've been trying to get the other commentors to see, that the Jena 6 CHOSE to break the law and in doing so took the risk of being charged with anything -even MURDER if the other kid had died. They could have walked away. No charges. Thank you. By choosing violence... by choosing to violate the law... by choosing to hit a guy in the head from behind... by choosing to stomp his unconscious body... by choosing to kick his unconscious body... -they have brought valid charges on themselves though they might not like the end result. How many fights has anyone out there seen where six people continue to assault an unconscious person? Hmmm... ATTEMPTED MURDER. REDUCED CHARGE 2ND DEGREE ASSAULT. POSSIBLE HATE CRIME. FOR WHICH CHARGES THE LAW PRESCRIBES CERTAIN PARAMETERS OF PUNISHMENT. Would it be any different in New York? No. Racism? Excessive? No. The only agenda I see here is a self-righteous beating of the drum... and another double standard by some commentors... Christ, you people make me sick. by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Sunday, Sep 2, 2007 at 11:18:28 PM (0+)
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G*ddamn Troll Alert From Hell...
There's some truth to what you're saying -but IT'S NOT THE LIBERALS WHO HAVE A PAST TRACK RECORD OF BLATANTLY BEING AGAINST CIVIL RIGHTS, WORKERS' RIGHTS, BEING PRO-SEGREGATION, ENACTING JIM CROW LAWS, AND GENERALLY SPITTING IN THE FACE OF THE NOTION OF DIGNITY THROUGH EQUALITY... IN ALL FORMS RACIAL, GENDER, ECONOMIC, AND SEXUAL PREFERENCE. You're a perfect example of what Bob Dylan's song 'A Pawn in Their Game' is all about... and perhaps one of what Hunter S. Thompson called the 'Generation of Swine'. The article in question doesn't have to mention your insecurities nor your ideas of 'reverse racism' because that's not what the thrust of this discussion is about. (And you thought I had an agenda, Anthony!) My only problem was with what I've already stated and wondering about your glib view of the world as evidenced with "OMG it's even worse than I thought..." Well, I got news for ya: Santa and the Easter Bunny aren't real either. How is it that I knew the facts, was able to post the facts, and had read EVEN the Truthout piece before Rob posted his link... AND you were only able to glean your info from 'what is barely being written about it in the Alternative Press'??? And on top of that -you turned out to be wrong on the facts... If I had an 'agenda' as you claimed -it would have been calling bullshit when I see it. You were ill-informed and wrote an article with certain fluff and propaganda and used some Republican tactics when called on it... Shame on you! I hope next time your niavety won't taint your piece and that you'll have the actual facts before you rail off against someone who does know the facts and gets the impression he knew them a good deal longer than you probably even knew about the case to begin with... All this -and I didn't have to post a very suspect picture of myself with the American Flag behind me! Or try to cover some sense of latent white-guilt by writing an article to show how compassionate and empathetic I can be for those who aren't 'white like my Jesus'... The whole thing smacked of self-righteousness -the kind that says 'Hey, I've got BLACK FRIENDS... THAT PROVES I'M NOT A RACIST!'... Now I guess it's me that's beating a dead horse... But that's better than beating an unconscious teenager, isn't it? by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Monday, Sep 3, 2007 at 6:29:03 AM (0+)
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Reply: Oh yeah...
Cagey, You're still an idiot. Don't you have a wooden cross or something to be working on for that other clandestine militia meeting that'll take place just after sundown??? Or maybe some nooses to braid to hand out to your kids so they can hang them in the tree they eat their own lunches under? Dumbass. by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Monday, Sep 3, 2007 at 6:47:52 AM (0+)
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Missed This
I missed alot of the end here. I will only say this: Pappy, whatever your issue with me is, you make it blatently obvious everytime you step into my threads to muck them up. I know you don't like me very much because i believe in God and that is your right. i do not mind because for all your psuedo-intelligence, you make an ass of yourself when you attack me for no reason. Your comment that because i titled my article "Racism in the Dirty South" i somehow stated that racism only belongs in the south is beyond stupid. This was an incident that occured in the south you moron. I did research on the term dirty south before i named just to make sure LA was included historically. I named it that becuase THIS incident occured in the south. Just do me a favor and keep your silly comments to yourself. You are a borderline troll. The rest of your arguments are as usual, strawmen. Crowbait - we have apparently made peace in the other thread so i will refrain except to say that to say race had nothing to do with this is naive. If this had been a black kid beat up by a bunch of white teens in Jena, they would not be facing the same charges. THAT was the point, they are over-charged. And for your info, the AP is a part of the lamestream media and not an independent source to be bragging about. AW by Anthony Wade (160 articles, 2 quicklinks, 44 diaries, 890 comments [19 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Monday, Sep 3, 2007 at 8:12:29 PM (0+)
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What's the buzz?
Pappy, whatever your issue with me is, you make it blatently obvious everytime you step into my threads to muck them up. I know you don't like me very much because i believe in God and that is your right. i do not mind because for all your psuedo-intelligence, you make an ass of yourself when you attack me for no reason. Your comment that because i titled my article "Racism in the Dirty South" i somehow stated that racism only belongs in the south is beyond stupid. This was an incident that occured in the south you moron. I did research on the term dirty south before i named just to make sure LA was included historically. I named it that becuase THIS incident occured in the south. Just do me a favor and keep your silly comments to yourself. You are a borderline troll. The rest of your arguments are as usual, strawmen. Well, it looks like you are also in the business of ad hominem attacks. Let's see, I am a moron. I am possessed of pseudo-intelligence. I also make an ass of myself. My arguments are stupid and made of straw men. Gee, tell me how you really feel. I don't have a problem with you normally. I have a problem with you when you become a self-righteous crud. You have done so with me at least twice that I can recall. Other than that, you are incredibly unimportant in my life. Make it three with this post. As far as "mucking up" your posts, who the hell died and turned every word you write into the absolute truth, unworthy of being questioned? by Pappy (61 articles, 0 quicklinks, 11 diaries, 860 comments [5 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Sep 4, 2007 at 2:37:59 AM (1+)
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Reply: Pap
I will try and keep it short because i know that this kind of exchange is what feeds you. I will be very clear. This is the second time you have come into a thread of mine for the sole purpose of trying to cause dissension. That is why you are a borderline troll. The arguments you make are strawmen, meaning they are not points i ever made nor supported. Ad hominem would require you to have made a cogent argument, which you have not. Lets just review the ridiculous point you keep to clingning to. I wrote an article called "Racism in the Dirty South", because there is an issue of racism in the south. No where do i infer that racism only exists in the south. Not in the title, nor the article. Your ridiculous argument is that because i correctly point out that this incident occured in the south, that I have maligned the entire southern portion of the states. Now i know you do not really believe this because no sane thinking person could. Thus i know that your purpose was merely to cause the very dissension we are now dealing with, which again is why you are a borderline troll. I have no problem with my words being questioned, next time, try having a point. The rest of your post is again a strawman argument. You continue to make it because you think you can score cheap points. There are no implications Pappy. There is only you, making yourself look foolish. By the way, for you to call me a whiner after your crybaby tantrum in the Pseudonym thread is beyond the pale. Lastly, you have crossed the line at the end of your post. You have said: "You think that your religion means you are better than I, and you have said so on more than one occasion" I do not mind occasional libel but now you have backed yourself into a corner with your arrogance. Please post where it is that i said this multiple times, or heck, even once. I never have nor would i ever say something so repulsive. I am better than no one. by Anthony Wade (160 articles, 2 quicklinks, 44 diaries, 890 comments [19 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Wednesday, Sep 5, 2007 at 10:19:31 AM (0+)
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Reply: Clarification
While the "attacks" were not ad hominem, meaning designed to avoid the substantive points, they were attacks nonetheless. So i apologize for calling you a moron. Quite honestly, i know you are not a moron. Unfortunately when things regress, they are designed to detract from the substantive points, which was not my desire. The facts remain. You have no point pappy. There was no inference in my article that racism is only in the south. I know you know this. The important thing is these six kids facing the obliteration of their lives. I'd prefer we got back to that, since it is what matters. Lastly, the slur you posted last time still stands out there. I would appreciate of you either point to the spot where i claimed my religion makes me better than you, or apologize for such a libelous statement. AW by Anthony Wade (160 articles, 2 quicklinks, 44 diaries, 890 comments [19 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Wednesday, Sep 5, 2007 at 12:17:18 PM (0+)
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JENE 6
Sir or Ma'am I want to know why this story is receiving so little Media attention? This is absolutely criminal, and in the year 2007 we all know the Media has the power to make this right if you choose to do so. The internet should not be the sole source of information on this case, stop letting America sleep walk on these 6 lives, whether you agree with their actions or not, at least the media could agree they need better legal representation. This IS not a story for later, please act now. Just so you know i sent this e-mail to every media outfit i could think of, CNN, ABC, NBC, AND CBS by EARL DIXON (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 2 comments) on Tuesday, Sep 4, 2007 at 1:27:03 PM (0+)
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CNN 8PM EDT TUESDAY
or at least that's what their website said. However, I would like to point out that they covered this story some time ago even though they (and I'll agree with you) are Lamestream Media themselves... but they did report accurately the details that I discussed earlier which seem to have escaped some of the 'alternative media' outlets and let us get into such a heated exchange over details which, I hope you'll agree, could really be the (forgive the term) lynchpin in the case for or against whether it is excessive or racist in terms of punishment... BUT THIS ONLY APPLIES AS TO THE SIX BLACK YOUTHS AS THEY ARE THE ONLY ONES CHARGED. Otherwise, it automatically seems excessive because nothing was done to any of their white antagonists... this could be an issue where there is the burden of proof required to charge them with a crime (just because you say someone pulled a gun on you, doesn't necessarily convince the white officer that somebody did)... Racial slurs being hurled is well within a person's rights -and they might deserve a good beat down or two but you have to be willing to suffer the consequences if you decide to resort to violence. Hanging nooses in a tree (with the obvious implications of the threat of lynching) may be well over the line of anyone's tolerance but it is still within a person's rights to do so. The fact that it happened at a school and that very little was done about it is extremely disturbing considering the already volatile racial tension where the incident took place... and then there's the DA spewing forth such ilk in the form threatening the entire populace of black students at the school that you'd think his job would almost immediately be terminated... then there's the failure of the public defender (what do we know about him?)... the all white jury (which, on the surface, DOES sound incredibly racist but given the very low percentage of blacks within that court's jurisdiction, does that work out to just be a mathematical likelyhood that the jury will wind up being white in almost every instance? Or is it actual racism in action?). It's truly so multi-faceted that it, indeed, DOES come off looking very one-sided... But looks can be deceiving. Myself, I wish I knew so much more about it. by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Tuesday, Sep 4, 2007 at 5:10:12 PM (0+)
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clarification...again
If you would go to THIS article...go to your reply entitled "Job". There you will find this: "But since you do not believe the Bible, what do you care. You said it all pappy. You went and had sex with 3 men and did not feel as though you sinned. THAT is why you rebel because you know that the sin of choice you make is an abomination in the eyes of God. Since you would rather sin guilt free, you choose to dismiss God's existance." If this doesn't qualify as you telling me you are better than I, then what is it? Sin? Abomination? It seems pretty clear to me what your message was. And once again, you ignore the fact that I have agreed with you on many other points...and yes, if you ask, I can look for them as well. It's nice to have all my comments and articles in one place so I can research what I have written, and what others have written to me. What you see as someone mucking up your writing, I see as me asking questions. I am not here to f*ck with you, piss on your parade, or whatnot. I am here to write, debate, and discuss. You are an ancillary, unimportant blip on the radar screen of my life. I have better things to do with my time than to follow behind you just so I can piss in your Wheaties. It just so happens that you wrote and article and I responded to it. How many articles have you written that I completely ignored? If you said, "most of them," you'd be right. And frankly, I don't care if you think I am being a troll, or a moron, or whatever. You can think me a doctor, but that won't give me the degrees, the education, or even put a stethoscope around my neck. What I don't understand is there have been replies that look very trollish here, and they weren't written by me. I was going to speak to it, because I thought it missed the point, but someone else called bullshit on it first, so I didn't have to. Perhaps I should have so you would have at least seen that I'm not here to deride or destroy you in any way. That was my mistake. So, you go on thinking what you will of me. As I said above, I really don't much care. If you can't deal with people who have a dissenting point of view, then I question what you are doing here at all. You can go to my latest article, and see that there were many people who dissented and disagreed with me. I handled the situations...and I think I did a pretty good job. I am sorry if it seems I was trying to get your goat. That wasn't my intent. You should really work on thickening your skin a bit. Blessed be! by Pappy (61 articles, 0 quicklinks, 11 diaries, 860 comments [5 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Thursday, Sep 6, 2007 at 3:54:14 AM (1+)
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Oh, I forgot...
...it is fantastic that this particular news item did finally get national exposure after your article. If your article had any part in that, then congrats. Blessed be! by Pappy (61 articles, 0 quicklinks, 11 diaries, 860 comments [5 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Thursday, Sep 6, 2007 at 4:00:02 AM (1+)
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Pappy
I will not allow you to dodge the point again. Your example, which is one because you know there are no others, is as poor as your assertion that titling my article inferred racism was only in the south. The exact quote from that darwin thread was: "God restored Job and gave him double what he had prior to the testing period. But since you do not believe the Bible, what do you care. You said it all pappy. You went and had sex with 3 men and did not feel as though you sinned. THAT is why you rebel because you know that the sin of choice you make is an abomination in the eyes of God. Since you would rather sin guilt free, you choose to dismiss God's existance." I am sorry but where exactly do i reference myself??? Oh thats right, nowhere. Pappy, you have serious issues with anger and repressed feelings, particularly as it relates to how you feel about yourself and Christianity. In this thread i am simply pointing out that since you dismiss the entire bible, what do you care what it says? I then simply reflected your own words back to you Pappy. You had said that you felt no guilt about having sex with three men. You also said that you have read the entire Bible, thus you know that GOD says it is an abomination in HIS eyes. Thus the only way for you to enjoy what you like, you dismiss God and His existance. But NOWHERE do i say that you are somehow less than me. Nowhere do i say that I am better than anyone else. I am not. While my sins are not the same as yours, they make me equal to you in the eyes of God. But lets see what your response was to this fair comment, shall we? "matters little whether Job got it all back or not. He was made to suffer incredibly for a point. He was made to lose everything and then some just so god could boast proudly about him to Satan. That is not the action of a loving deity! That's the action of an arrogant f*ck who cares nothing about the suffering of his supposed underlings. If you want to love a vindictive f*ck head like that, if you want to worship a god that will use you as a pawn, or as a means to prove a point, then you get what you get...nothing! Of course I am the whiner right? Never mind that I never said you were an abomination. I said what the Bible says, which you claimed to have read entirely. No where do i cast aspersions. I used your own words Pappy. I never even mention myself. YOU claimed to have read the entire Bible. YOU said that you felt no guilt of sin for your behavior. Thus YOU chose the road you walk Pappy. You are just a sinner Pappy, as is every other man and woman. No better and no worse. I still wait for the apology Pappy. I never said i was better than you and you know it. I never said my religion makes me better than you. by Anthony Wade (160 articles, 2 quicklinks, 44 diaries, 890 comments [19 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Thursday, Sep 6, 2007 at 10:08:36 AM (0+)
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then...
...you wait for nothing. I still wait for the apology Pappy. I never said i was better than you and you know it. I never said my religion makes me better than you. And you ignore the fact that I have only commented on a few of your articles. I am not going to apologize to you as I did nothing wrong.
You accuse me of coming here to mess up your space. You have not come close to proving this. Your continuous whining here about an alleged attack by me is what you call a strawman. This is especially true when others have come here to this thread and have been very trollish, and very virulent, and have attacked more vociferously than I ever have. I owe you no apology, and I will not give you one. You are welcome to keep on whining all you want. As of now, I am no longer coming here to bother with you. You bore me! Blessed be nonetheless! by Pappy (61 articles, 0 quicklinks, 11 diaries, 860 comments [5 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Thursday, Sep 6, 2007 at 1:37:50 PM (1+)
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Reply: 22 more comments, Pappy, and...
who knows? You may be elevated from just being a sinner and make it to Anti-Christ status! I'd give you a run for the money but I got a late start... 666. It would be foolish to think that the Christian Bible should hold sway over any other system of belief or lack thereof... As foolish as thinking those who do not revere the Quran are infidels deserving of death... In order to be bound by either system you must believe in either system... Otherwise, ye point out splinters while ignoring thine timber... Whatever. Nice spectator sport... by C.Bid (0 articles, 7 quicklinks, 7 diaries, 739 comments [2 recommended, 0 rejected]) on Thursday, Sep 6, 2007 at 9:23:40 PM (0+)
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Didn't think so
I didn't think you were a man with any honor, no surprises here. You have been exposed and now you are dismissed. Nice try on continuing to change the subject with your paper thin strawmen. by Anthony Wade (160 articles, 2 quicklinks, 44 diaries, 890 comments [19 recommended, 2 rejected]) on Friday, Sep 14, 2007 at 5:35:13 AM (0+)
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