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MARC STEINER: It's only 5 seats in the Knesset.
LIA TARACHANSKY: That's right, making itself the kingmaker and toppling Netanyahu's attempt to form a coalition. What this is is Avigdor Lieberman seeing an opportunity, a political opportunity, and jumping on it. You also have to remember that the same day that the attempt to form a coalition collapsed in Israel, yesterday, Kushner landed in Tel Aviv on his attempt to now bring the Trump administration's so-called peace plan into the Middle East in talks that are set to take place in Bahrain very soon.
So all of this has implications for Avigdor Lieberman, because he is fundamentally opposed to any peace agreement that compromises land in exchange for peace.
MARC STEINER: So there are a few things you raised here, and I kind of want to explore them. One has to do with this peace deal that they have, which to me is not much of a peace deal. It really has sort of more to do with Palestinian capitulation, and throwing out dribs and drabs of we'll give you some economic aid and help you build an economy.
LIA TARACHANSKY: But that has been thethat has been the practice, the reality on the ground, since the Oslo Accords. The Trump administration is just making it official. For the first time, they're actually putting the words next to the actions the Americans and Israelis have been taking. So there's nothing new about this deal. This is what the Israelis have been doing all along.
MARC STEINER: So when the American press makes a huge deal that isthat the Kushner plan could be killed or dead on arrival because of thesebecause of what's happening, and the government having to have a new election and falling apart, you don't put much credence to that. You think this is just smoke and mirrors.
LIA TARACHANSKY: I don't think the Kushner plan makes much difference to what happens on the ground. If you look at what has been happening the concrete things that have been happening over the last 25 years, what you will see is what we are now talking about, what Netanyahu claims will be his new political move under the Trump agreement, which is annexation of Area C and B, and pushing the Palestinian population into Area A, total Israeli sovereignty over the West Bank and the so-called end of the temporary permanent occupation. That is what has been happening on the ground. Netanyahu is just putting a name to it, and Trump is jumping on board, because if Israel actually applies sovereignty over the West Bank and hands off the Gaza Strip to the Egyptians, then the conflict as we know it will end. It will now become a completely different conflict. And the Israelis and the Americans will claim that they actually have ended the conflict.
So seeing here is Avigdor Lieberman seeing an opportunity and jumping on it, and unfortunately very, very successfully. The other side of that card, of course, is that Gantz, the person who was supposed to have been given the chance to now form a coalition by the president, the person who won the same number of votes as Netanyahu, is not jumping on this opportunity; basically not doing anything. Calling for a big protest in Tel Aviv, which was, you know, a bunch of people who agree with each other, reading [inaudible] to each other. They already know how they're going to end. But before [inaudible] that's the only thing he's done. So what he has demonstrated is that if he was given the opportunity to run the country, he would have been a vanilla, non-existent leader, which is what we've seen in this entire crisis.
MARC STEINER: So with Netanyahu's wife, for some reason I'm blanking on her first name at the moment.
LIA TARACHANSKY: Sara.
MARC STEINER: Sara. Thank you. I should remember that, it's in my family all over the place. When she pled guilty, in a sense, today, and as a result of all of this, I mean, does that say that the Netanyahus are really worried about what could happen in terms of the indictment, what could happen in terms of his leadership the coalition, that this was a way for her to kind of make sure that if anything does happen, she doesn't go to jail? I mean, or however that will run out? I mean, what do you think that means?
LIA TARACHANSKY: I think that the Netanyahu family, both Netanyahu the senior Netanyahu, Benjamin Netanyahu's brother Yonatan, who died in the Operation Entebbe, Bibi Netanyahu and his sons see themselves as a kind of dynasty in Israeli politics. The Prime Minister's father was instrumental in the foundation of the state of Israel, and was one of its most consistent ideologues, arguing for the ethnic cleansing of all non-Jews from Israel. His son was killed in an operation in Africa trying to save kidnapped Israelis, and his other son has been prime minister in Israel for 10 years, having been, you know, now in the middle of all of these both political and criminal crises.
So what Netanyahu has been doing, first of all, is making sure that as soon as the election in April had taken place he would have all of the steps that he needs ready to push what was supposed to be his first hearing in June to as far back as possible. And he succeeded to move it to early October. So that was his first move. And that's what he's been throwing all of his energy at, has been basically interrogating his own party to make sure that all of his own party will support this clear abortion of justice. And he succeeded. He managed to push his appearance to court to October, which is why the elections are, these new elections, are called for September. And of course if he wins again, he will then push that back and back and back and back.
The other thing he's been doing is priming his son for politics. Both his sons are kind of notorious in the Israeli press for beingI don't know how you say it in English. Men who have no accomplishments. And he has been-
MARC STEINER: Ne'er-do-wells.
LIA TARACHANSKY: Thank you very much. Netanyahu, Bibi Netanyahu, has been essentially cleaning up their reputations and prepping them as much as he can for politics, trying to shove his son the way Trump has been shoving Kushner into the camera, into the public sphere, and trying to make a case for this person becoming the next natural leader. So we have seen that even Netanyahu'seven if Netanyahu will one day now be prime minister, he is trying to continue the Netanyahu dynasty. So Sara Netanyahu pleading as she did today is just one of those longyou can call them long-term game moves.
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