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Best Web OpEds 11/30/2018 at 22:02:25

Democracy for America Poll: Pick Your Top 3 Candidates for President 2020 (Clinton: not on the list)

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Headlined to H2 11/30/18

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The link for the Poll might work as a link, but because it is a URL and can't be published here as text, search

Bernie Sanders, Vermont Senator

Joe Biden, Former Vice President

Tulsi Gabbard, Hawaii Congresswoman

Julián Castro, Former Secretary of HUD

Eric Garcetti, Mayor of LA

Kirstin Gillibrand, New York Senator

Kamala Harris, California Senator

Eric Holder, Former Attorney General

Elizabeth Warren, Massachusetts Senator

Jeff Merkley, Oregon Senator

Amy Klobuchar, Minnesota Senator

Chris Murphy, Connecticut Senator

Tom Steyer, California Philanthropist

Cory Booker, New Jersey Senator

Luis Gutiérrez, Illinois Congressman

Mitch Landrieu, Former New Orleans Mayor

Sherrod Brown, Ohio Senator

Stacey Abrams, Former Georgia House Minority Leader

Beto O'Rourke, Texas Congressman

Andrew Gillum, Tallahassee Mayor

Read the rest of the story HERE:

At poll.democracyforamerica.com

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Early in the 2016 Primary campaign, I started a Facebook group: Bernie Sanders: Advice and Strategies to Help Him Win! As the primary season advanced, we shifted the focus to advancing Bernie's legislation in the Senate, particularly the most (more...)

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7 people are discussing this page, with 23 comments

William WAUGH

(Member since Jun 8, 2016), 52 comments

The online tool wouldn't let me fill in three write-ins.

Submitted on Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 11:04:12 PM

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Stephen Fox

(Member since Jan 21, 2007), 29 fans, 349 articles, 89 quicklinks, 2592 comments, 14 diaries

Reply to William WAUGH:

Check back in a few. I will fix that.

Submitted on Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 11:17:39 PM

(1+)

Stephen Fox

(Member since Jan 21, 2007), 29 fans, 349 articles, 89 quicklinks, 2592 comments, 14 diaries

Reply to Stephen Fox:

I did click on Permalink, and it works. If not for you, just do the search the desription describes, please.

Submitted on Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 11:27:56 PM

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Jim Thomas

(Member since Jan 15, 2013), 2 fans, 244 comments

Write in - Mickey Mouse (unless he has joined either of the two major political parties).

Submitted on Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 11:19:35 PM

(2+)

Stephen Fox

(Member since Jan 21, 2007), 29 fans, 349 articles, 89 quicklinks, 2592 comments, 14 diaries

Reply to Jim Thomas:

This is a serious article about a serious poll.

Submitted on Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 11:38:18 PM

(1+)

John Zwiebel

(Member since Jun 19, 2017), 2 fans, 199 comments

Reply to Stephen Fox:

Stephen, I think Jim gave a serious answer. I understand why you object, but your objection is kind of along the same lines as all those KOS articles about how it was the Sandernistas that cost Clinton the 2016 election.

The alienation we all feel toward our elected representatives is going to be really hard to get over.

Submitted on Saturday, Dec 1, 2018 at 12:03:37 AM

(5+)

Stephen Fox

(Member since Jan 21, 2007), 29 fans, 349 articles, 89 quicklinks, 2592 comments, 14 diaries

Reply to John Zwiebel:

Well, great. He can vote for Mickey Mouse.

As to the KOS article about Sandernistas, nothing could be further from the truth or more irrelevant vis a vis ME than that. KOS is generally right on. Maybe you have twisted their comments a bit? They tend to be pretty rabid, but that is almost always warranted.

What you say about my article reminding you of that connection is quite absurd. This is a poll where in people express their choices SERIOUSLY.

Maybe you and Jim could someday soon both write your first article here at OpEdNews?

Submitted on Saturday, Dec 1, 2018 at 12:22:42 AM

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John Zwiebel

(Member since Jun 19, 2017), 2 fans, 199 comments

Reply to Stephen Fox:

Why don't you like my explanation. So, you agree that Clinton lost because of the Sanders voters? Apparently, to deny that KOS didn't blame Sanders voters for Clinton's loss is to ignore the facts. I suffered plenty of insults directed at me because I kept referring to the Susan Sarandon interview with Chris Hayes and explaining that I was not going to vote for a corporatist.

Your article isn't what prompted me to respond, it was your insistence that voting for Micky Mouse wasn't serious. It is a statement of disillusionment that is so strong that the author is making it clear he plans to "opt out".

Similar to when I again say, "I'm not voting for a corporatist".

Submitted on Monday, Dec 3, 2018 at 7:03:22 PM

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Stephen Fox

(Member since Jan 21, 2007), 29 fans, 349 articles, 89 quicklinks, 2592 comments, 14 diaries

Reply to John Zwiebel:

I don't agree that Clinton lost because of the Sanders voters, and certainly not that they had any obligation to vote for her, and nor did he have any obligation to tell them to do so. I haven't been pouring over KOS for very long, but I rather doubt that they made that big a point of their idea that Sanders voters were somehow responsible for her loss.

She lost because she had too much baggage, was deeply flawed, and only a very few TRUSTED her.

I am a life long Yellow Dog Democrat raised in liberal circles and have been politically active since 1960 at the age of 12 when I volunteered to hang article bags on the doors in central Illinois.

I do, however, understand the point of view that the idea of voting for Mickey is somehow revealing and somewhat serious. If I were in that frame of mind, which I am never in, I would have voted for my childhood hero, Alfred E. Newman.

All of my friends at the time (and even a few teachers!) told me I looked like Alfred, and no doubt, a depraved childhood fascination with all of the Mad Magazines and supplemental readers augmented my accelerated growth, forcing my being skipped from the middle of 4th grade to the middle of 5th grade. A half century of suffering!

The History of Alfred E. Neuman's Image For a more detailed story of the image's history, see: therealalfrede.blogspot .com/2013/03/the-real-alfred-e .html.
(Image by YouTube, Channel: Dish Waterhands) Permission Details DMCA

Vote for whomever you wish.

Submitted on Monday, Dec 3, 2018 at 7:51:32 PM

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George King

(Member since Aug 11, 2014), 16 fans, 19 articles, 2478 comments, 1 diaries

Reply to John Zwiebel:

John, I expand on this, "The alienation we all feel toward our elected representatives is going to be really hard to get over" in my second reply to Nelson, you may be interested.

Submitted on Tuesday, Dec 4, 2018 at 4:16:38 AM

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John Zwiebel

(Member since Jun 19, 2017), 2 fans, 199 comments

Well, so far 15% have voted for Biden. NFW am I voting for a corporatist. NFW am I voting for the guy who made crack cocaine use a bigger "crime" than "white mans" cocaine. NFW am I voting for the guy who dissed Anita Hill. NFW am I voting for Obama's VP.

I'll support Tulsi Gabbard to the max. She's my congresswoman and she answers my questions the way I want to hear them. The other choices are all conditional.

Submitted on Saturday, Dec 1, 2018 at 12:00:21 AM

(3+)

BFalcon

(Member since Dec 20, 2008), 21 fans, 3 articles, 16297 comments

Tom Steyer -doing what he preaches.

Submitted on Saturday, Dec 1, 2018 at 2:25:01 AM

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Stephen Fox

(Member since Jan 21, 2007), 29 fans, 349 articles, 89 quicklinks, 2592 comments, 14 diaries

Two interesting comments from this article being posted on Run Tulsi Run, a Facebook group:

Gerry Simon During the dem primaries and when Hillary swept the south, it was, in large part, because they had no clue who Bernie was and what he stood for. It is my understanding that later in the primaries when they were exxposed to some of the debates and Bernies agenda, many wished they would have voted for him instead of the well recognized clinton name. I take you point, Steve, and have no doubt you are correct, but we need to get her thru the primaries first, lest she fall into the same hole that took the south away from Bernie. Fri Nov 30, 8:11pm Comment History

Steve Fulk Uhm, I live in dipshit hillbilly redneck Trump country, trust me...they get their news from three places..church parking lots after service, gun shows and Fox News. That's not changing anytime soon when they already consider you an outsider and the feeling your trying to get over on them. Remember, technology really didn't hit these areas until 20 years ago and now the picture box (akacomputer) is spreading even better conversation starters. It will be generations of young kids to leave these places, get some culture, move back home and make changes. Right now, it's what maw maw, pawpaw and grandmaw say to vote! Fri Nov 30, 7:35pm

Submitted on Saturday, Dec 1, 2018 at 3:18:31 AM

(2+)

George King

(Member since Aug 11, 2014), 16 fans, 19 articles, 2478 comments, 1 diaries

Same old crap from DFA! I had to give my email and name, wanted my ph# as well!

Of course Tulsi was my choice and wrote in 2nd & 3rd Tulsi but lo and behold she is a no show in % of votes cast.

For those of us who have went through chucking the subscribe list on all the faux Democrat Progressive channels who are nothing more than divide and conquer, take your donations and still push the neocon/neoliberal agenda with their candidates while doubling down on manufacturing consent quit passing this junk on to our participation.

The owners of this country don't give a sh*t about you and any American Dream you have to be a sleep to believe under the duopoly one party or the other just doesn't matter.

Now I will have to unsubscribe from DFA BS 10 times before they quit flooding my inbox from many sources that they share in manufacturing consent. Thanks for nothing, you are better than this Stephen or so I thought.

Submitted on Saturday, Dec 1, 2018 at 4:29:48 PM

(2+)

Stephen Fox

(Member since Jan 21, 2007), 29 fans, 349 articles, 89 quicklinks, 2592 comments, 14 diaries

Reply to George King:

Tulsi Gabbard + Chandrika Tandon: Women in Leadership on Creating Change Tulsi Gabbard--the first Hindu to be elected to Congress, representing Hawaii's second district since 2013--joins in conversation with Chandrika Tandon, ...
(Image by YouTube, Channel: RubinMuseum) Permission Details DMCA

You really have it all wrong, George. In fact, I have always really liked Tulsi personally, not only remembering what she did for Bernie early on, but also because she continually speaks out on issues vital to me, not accepting PAC money, and speaking against supporting the Yemen War.

In fact, this was the first poll I have seen in which people could participate, rather than just read about big shot polls that invariably put Joe Biden at the top. That is why I posted it.

Personally, I was glad above all not to see HRC on the list.

I dutifully shared the poll to all of the Tulsi groups on Facebook of which I am a member, some with 25,000 members, and it would appear that the members would prefer to wrangle and debate which should come first, and the merits of various running mates, etc., rather than actually vote. Same phenomenon happened with the many Beto groups on Facebook and I am in about 40 thereof.

The numbers came up the way the votes were cast. Surely you comprehend that. I merely posted the poll so readers could participate in a vote.

You needn't be so recalcitrant and rueful, just because Tulsi didn't make this particular cut. Not my fault, not my doing.

Or maybe you are one of those folks who shoot the messenger because you don't like the message that ends up being delivered?

Submitted on Saturday, Dec 1, 2018 at 5:38:53 PM

(1+)

George King

(Member since Aug 11, 2014), 16 fans, 19 articles, 2478 comments, 1 diaries

Reply to Stephen Fox:

Stephen, you didn't read my experience on casting my vote and the % results did not acknowledge not even 1% of votes cast for Tulsi, really?

DFA is not credible for many reasons in its past history and this experience is no different. Do you contribute to the Stop Citizens United Fund? There is a long history of faux manufacturing consent groups that fly the banner of revolution but practice divide and conquer and suck any contributions to do their bidding rather than what they say they advocate for.

Your cred depends on your actions and you profess a group as mentioned before, then you either have not been paying attention or you are one and the same in lack of credibility? Please do not take this personally; it was all meant in personal responsibility that we all have to take in this battle of sinners and saints. Maybe you should do a little research in what I have stated here?

Submitted on Saturday, Dec 1, 2018 at 6:16:54 PM

(0+)

Stephen Fox

(Member since Jan 21, 2007), 29 fans, 349 articles, 89 quicklinks, 2592 comments, 14 diaries

Reply to George King:

I read it all. You are dismayed because Tulsi's votes were less than the five shown. I just put the poll up as news and as participatory democracy.

Submitted on Saturday, Dec 1, 2018 at 8:30:15 PM

(1+)

George King

(Member since Aug 11, 2014), 16 fans, 19 articles, 2478 comments, 1 diaries

Reply to Stephen Fox:

Stephen, you need to work on your reading comprehension and this will be my last word on this. "Or (in your words) maybe you are one of those folks who shoot the messenger because you don't like the message that ends up being delivered?"

There is a trust or not in following a known author of an article or a comment which we ferret out in the early stages of communications. We either rely on this trust or understanding based on reliability. In your case I repeat I can't trust your thoughts and actions when it cost more than it is worth.

It is always a matter of trust and the repercussions of ill placement of it.

Submitted on Sunday, Dec 2, 2018 at 7:23:32 PM

(0+)

Stephen Fox

(Member since Jan 21, 2007), 29 fans, 349 articles, 89 quicklinks, 2592 comments, 14 diaries

Reply to George King:

Let me get this straight. You are telling a professional editor and writer with 49 years of experience after college with two books and thousands of articles that he should "work on his reading comprehension"? What supreme aplomb.

This are the sentences I found fault with of yours:

First: "Thanks for nothing, you are better than this Stephen or so I thought."

"Better than this," publishing the availability of a poll whose results you find fault with just because you vote for a person, 1,2, and 3, and the person's results are below the threshold of the five candidates whose results they present.

Second: "Of course Tulsi was my choice and wrote in 2nd & 3rd Tulsi but lo and behold she is a no show in % of votes cast."

You expressed disappointment in that poll, when in fact polls are all about statistics and the results of the statistics are not the fault of the poster of the poll, nor the DFA origin of the poll itself.

END OF CONVERSATION(S), please.

Submitted on Monday, Dec 3, 2018 at 9:52:51 PM

(0+)

Nelson Wight

(Member since Apr 23, 2010), 17 fans, 2636 comments

Reply to George King:

I put Tulsi, too. Perhaps I should fear her age - 37 ????

Submitted on Monday, Dec 3, 2018 at 12:52:41 AM

(0+)

George King

(Member since Aug 11, 2014), 16 fans, 19 articles, 2478 comments, 1 diaries

Reply to Nelson Wight:

Let us think about this Nels, 37 to run in two years = 39 + 8 year Presidency = 47 years old. With her intelligence, strong fortitude and military experience out of country and in war country combat experience, major rank achieved with dignity and uncompromising principles who knows who and where power lies and does not shirk from her duty to speak truth to power in favor of the US citizens despite the criticism she knows will come. She is the most qualified candidate for the time and the re-emergence of a strong nation state, ham strung by no outside forces of nations nor other powers.

That's our President and 1st Woman to occupy the White House as Commander in Chief of all Armed Forces and the one to expose, confront, and defeat all enemies from within and without the US and our true allies not criminal cabal vassals.

The alternative is outlined for us by Ian Williams Goddard

"When a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object, evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security." -- "The Declaration of Independence" "A society whose citizens refuse to see and investigate the facts, who refuse to believe that their government and their media will routinely lie to them and fabricate a reality contrary to verifiable facts, is a society that chooses and deserves the Police State Dictatorship it's going to get."

Submitted on Monday, Dec 3, 2018 at 9:12:02 PM

(1+)

Nelson Wight

(Member since Apr 23, 2010), 17 fans, 2636 comments

Reply to George King:

Right you are, George. Sad that she hadn't been a U,S,Marine.

Submitted on Tuesday, Dec 4, 2018 at 1:40:36 AM

(0+)

George King

(Member since Aug 11, 2014), 16 fans, 19 articles, 2478 comments, 1 diaries

Reply to Nelson Wight:

Nels, there is a movement around the globe happening that has been ignored by the MSM or rather suppressed by the MSM for good reason. Have you seen any coverage of the yellow vest in France? Have you heard that a populist movement is afoot including in the US? Of course not from MSM and misunderstood by most.

You and I go back a ways Nels and if you can recall even before Bernie's ill-fated run I spoke of a common enemy and it would be when the common enemy is recognized and declared the ill-defined left and right would cease to be wagged (moved or caused to move rapidly to and fro) by a party, either party and the center (populist) would strike at the true injustices and those that have shackled citizens, not just in the US but around the world.

I have started research on this a while back and we are seeing it rising from the ashes. I mention the "Iron Law of Oligarchy" and link it to the theory until I am blue in the face but it is at the heart of what is happening today. Alain de Benoist touches on this and much more in his: "They are rather the proof of the extent of a malaise that took root in the crisis of representation: people have the feeling of no longer being represented by their representatives, many think that it's useless to make use of a sovereignty on the election day which they know they will lose the day after. That's why populisms aspire to more direct, referendum based, or participative forms of democracy, conscious of the dysfunctions and limits to a liberal democracy that has replaced popular sovereignty by parliamentary sovereignty and that is today directed by an oligarchic caste that only seeks to defend its interests alone".

I have made a couple of attempts to do a series on this but could not get past the gate keepers as one reason or another from do I have permissions (which I have) to mumbled reasons of rejection. I do not know that it is a battle that would be worth it in this forum, be what it may.

Submitted on Tuesday, Dec 4, 2018 at 4:00:05 AM

(0+)

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