Send a Tweet
Most Popular Choices
Poll Analyses
Share on Facebook 26 Share on Twitter 2 Printer Friendly Page More Sharing
Podcast    H1'ed 8/25/20

John Dean: Authoritarian Nightmare; Trump and His Followers

Follow Me on Twitter     Message Rob Kall
Become a Fan
  (302 fans)

Broadcast 8/25/2020 at 13:06:33 (26 Listens, 15 Downloads, 397 Itunes)
The Rob Kall Bottom Up Radio Show Podcast

Check out More Podcasts

Listen
Listen

listen on iTunes
iTunes

listen on SoundCloud
SoundCloud

Download
Download

View on Stitcher
View on Stitcher

Copyright © Rob Kall, All Rights Reserved. Do not duplicate or post on youtube or other sites without express permission. Creative commons permissions for this site do not apply to audio content or transcripts of audio content.

John Dean is co-author of the new book, Authoritarian Nightmare; Trump and His Followers, with Bob Altemeyer. Dean served as White House counsel for president Richard Nixon from 1970 to 1973. His Watergate testimony helped lead to Nixon's resignation. Past books include Worse than Watergate and Conservatives Without Conscience



"Like it or not, authoritarianism is on the ballot this November and to defeat it, we must understand it. "



Pre-interview notes

Why did you write this book and what do you want it to accomplish?


Essentially, authoritarianism is"..

Followers


You talk about Authoritarians, Autocrats, Demagogues and dictators. Please parse the differences and similarities for them and their followers.


What's the difference between Democracy and Autocracy

When do demagogues rise?


Authoritarians are usually elected and then they subvert the constitution



There are right and left wing authoritarians?

Discuss the connection between Authoritarianism and narcissism.
You say "Trump brings out the worst in people."

I have a theory that the worst plague Trump will bring to the US and the world will be the unleashing and unrestraining of narcissists and psychopaths.


Early Trump story

authoritarian TV personality


His supporters were "coiled like a tightly wound spring"


The next dictator is already watching Trump, how to do what he's done even better.

Authoritarians:
Social Dominator Authoritarians SD and Authoritarian Followers, Double Highs

Trump got 71% of white male voters without a college degree
Lost jobs, but also feeling of stolen White birthright


How Trump rolled up the social dominators:

Racial superiority meant a great deal.
Social dominators score high on the conman score, don't believe in right and wrong" psychopaths?



Unleashing authoritarianism and narcissism AND Psychopaths


Authoritarian Followers
Steven Hassan, The Cult of Trump

"

High degree of submission to the perceived, established, legitimate authorities in society
" High level of aggression in the name of their authorities
" High level of conventionalism, insisting that others follow the norms endorsed by their authorities (Taliban)

Right wing authoritarians are not necessarily right wing politically.
What about Democrats and lefties?


Right wing authoritarianism Scale (RWA) and Monmouth poll p 128

7 traits
" highly compartmentalized thinking
how they handle doubts

high vs low RWA

flimsy belief in America's values
have only a superficial belief in liberty and democracy
"
double standard judgments

believe many conflicting and even contradictory things,
less careful thinking,
more responsive to bombast
Difficulty judging evidence

Size: 83,534,912 -- 0 hrs, 58 min, 0 sec

Listen
Listen

listen on iTunes

listen on soundcloud

Download
Download

 

Must Read 1   Well Said 1   Valuable 1  
Rate It | View Ratings

Rob Kall Social Media Pages: Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in       Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in       Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in       Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

Rob Kall is an award winning journalist, inventor, software architect, connector and visionary. His work and his writing have been featured in the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, CNN, ABC, the HuffingtonPost, Success, Discover and other media. 

Check out his platform at RobKall.com

He is the author of The Bottom-up Revolution; Mastering the Emerging World of Connectivity  

He's given talks and workshops to Fortune 500 execs and national medical and psychological organizations, and pioneered first-of-their-kind conferences in Positive Psychology, Brain Science and Story. He hosts some of the world's smartest, most interesting and powerful people on his Bottom Up Radio Show, and founded and publishes one of the top Google- ranked progressive news and opinion sites, OpEdNews.com

more detailed bio: 

Rob Kall has spent his adult life as an awakener and empowerer-- first in the field of biofeedback, inventing products, developing software and a music recording label, MuPsych, within the company he founded in 1978-- Futurehealth, and founding, organizing and running 3 conferences: Winter Brain, on Neurofeedback and consciousness, Optimal Functioning and Positive Psychology (a pioneer in the field of Positive Psychology, first presenting workshops on it in 1985) and Storycon Summit Meeting on the Art Science and Application of Story-- each the first of their kind.  Then, when he found the process of raising people's consciousness and empowering them to take more control of their lives  one person at a time was too slow, he founded Opednews.com-- which has been the top search result on Google for the terms liberal news and progressive opinion for several years. Rob began his Bottom-up Radio show, broadcast on WNJC 1360 AM to Metro Philly, also available on iTunes, covering the transition of our culture, business and world from predominantly Top-down (hierarchical, centralized, authoritarian, patriarchal, big)  to bottom-up (egalitarian, local, interdependent, grassroots, archetypal feminine and small.) Recent long-term projects include a book, Bottom-up-- The Connection Revolution, debillionairizing the planet and the Psychopathy Defense and Optimization (more...)
 

Go To Commenting
The views expressed herein are the sole responsibility of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of this website or its editors.
Follow Me on Twitter     Writers Guidelines
Contact AuthorContact Author Contact EditorContact Editor Author PageView Authors' Articles
Support OpEdNews

OpEdNews depends upon can't survive without your help.

If you value this article and the work of OpEdNews, please either Donate or Purchase a premium membership.

STAY IN THE KNOW
If you've enjoyed this, sign up for our daily or weekly newsletter to get lots of great progressive content.
Daily Weekly     OpEdNews Newsletter
Name
Email
   (Opens new browser window)
 

Comments

The time limit for entering new comments on this podcast has expired.

This limit can be removed. Our paid membership program is designed to give you many benefits, such as removing this time limit. To learn more, please click here.

9 people are discussing this page, with 15 comments


Maxwell

Become a Fan
Author 4952
(Member since Feb 15, 2007), 2 fans, 4375 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

  New Content

Rob,

Looking forward to either the transcript or time to sit down and listen.

John Dean was a Republican with a conscience, which barely exists today. But despite Nixon's gross abuses of power, I don't think he was an authoritarian wannabe like Trump. Maybe you get into that in the interview.

Submitted on Tuesday, Aug 25, 2020 at 4:30:39 PM

  Recommend  (0+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?
Indent

John Lawrence Ré

Become a Fan
Author 78374
(Member since Apr 17, 2012), 28 fans, 3 articles, 1923 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Linked In Page Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

Reply to Maxwell:   New Content

Another democrat attempt to rehabilitate the scum of the earth. (Dean, Bush, McCain, et al). Where was John f*cking Dean's conscience when Nixon was dropping 10,000 bombs every 8 seconds on Laos for years on end? I could go on with a hundred other examples, but it's too patheitic that I even have to point out the hypocrisy here. Now the turd is being is held up as a saint becuase he calls Trump "authoritarian" when Nixon and every president in our lifetime was a model spkesperson for authoritarian governance by virtue of their linkage to the true rulers of America - MIC. He also mentions the most overused word in the English language, "narcissist." I don't think I've heard that word used more than a dozen times in my life until now in the TDS era when it's used a dozen times a day. Of course no one is pointing to the elephant in the room: the biggest narcissist in American history - Washingotn's own Bernie Madoff - Barack Obama. The democrat establishment is a cult of zombies all denying they're dead.

Submitted on Tuesday, Aug 25, 2020 at 7:51:52 PM

  Recommend  (10+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?
IndentIndent

Art Costa

Become a Fan
Author 48718
(Member since May 19, 2010), 3 fans, 1094 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

Reply to John Lawrence Ré:   New Content

Ironically Dean was saying the same things about GW Bush when he was in the WH. Now Bush is ok.

Submitted on Tuesday, Aug 25, 2020 at 8:04:57 PM

  Recommend  (3+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?
IndentIndentIndent

Maxwell

Become a Fan
Author 4952
(Member since Feb 15, 2007), 2 fans, 4375 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

Reply to Art Costa:   New Content

Did Dean ever say that Bush is OK now?

Submitted on Wednesday, Aug 26, 2020 at 4:29:29 PM

  Recommend  (0+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?
IndentIndent

Carol Jackson

Become a Fan
Author 61962
(Member since Mar 25, 2011), 2 fans, 972 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Not paid member and Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Not paid member and Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Not paid member and Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in Not paid member and Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

Reply to John Lawrence Ré:   New Content

Discrediting the messenger discredits the message.

Submitted on Thursday, Aug 27, 2020 at 5:24:53 PM

  Recommend  (0+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?
IndentIndent

Rob Kall

Become a Fan Follow Me on Twitter
(Member since Jun 5, 2005), 302 fans, 2595 articles, 5299 quicklinks, 6647 comments, 526 diaries (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

Reply to John Lawrence Ré:   New Content

A lot of people change and become better people. And a lot of people never forgive and never give them credit. Frankly, that is pathetic and worthy of contempt-- more contempt than you give to someone who woke up. I know a number of people who made mistakes, who did bad things and now they are different. They have changed. They are better people. They are making a difference. Your response is bitter and angry and childish. You could do a lot better. Find it within yourself. Dean is doing good here.

As far as narcissism goes, if you didn't hear about it, you were ignorant and perhaps even naive. I started writing about narcissists in 2013 and have done over 90 articles and interviews about narcissists and psychopaths. Here's the link to my series:

Psychopaths, Sociopaths and Narcissists Articles in the series referencing Trump start in 2015.

It doesn't take a victim of TDS (a right wing term-- Trump Derangement Disorder-- I had to look up the acronym though I'd heard the full phrase) to see that Trump is a malignant narcissist and psychopath,

Submitted on Thursday, Aug 27, 2020 at 6:37:48 PM

  Recommend  (0+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?
IndentIndentIndent

John Lawrence Ré

Become a Fan
Author 78374
(Member since Apr 17, 2012), 28 fans, 3 articles, 1923 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Linked In Page Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

Reply to Rob Kall:   New Content

Calm down, Rob. I never said people can't change or that we should hold past mistakes against them if they indeed do change. That's an offensive assumption that you angrily projected on to me. Attacking Trump doesn't mean Dean is suddenly a reformed person because you both don't like Trump. When he rejects his role in an admisintraiton that was involved in genocide, I'd be more than happy to acknowledge it. And of course I'm angry about that genocidal era, though I have forgiven myself for the minor role I was forced to play in it. It's just this phony character rehabilitation bullshit for political gain that triggers the anger. You may not understand that because you apparently were never in the military at the time. Trust me, you would if you had been.

Regarding narcissism - you again twisted what I wrote. Obviously I was referring to people calling out those they don't care for as narcissists. I wasn't referring to the concept per se as I, too, took pschology 101 in college. I was refering to the hypocrisy of singling out Trump's narcissism, unmistakable as it may be, when we've had a succession of narcissists in the white house, none more so than the last jackass narcissist, BO.

Submitted on Thursday, Aug 27, 2020 at 9:08:58 PM

  Recommend  (3+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?
IndentIndent

Blair Gelbond

Become a Fan
Author 71296
(Member since Sep 8, 2011), 4 fans, 27 articles, 341 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Not paid member and Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Not paid member and Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Not paid member and Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in Not paid member and Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

Reply to John Lawrence Ré:   New Content

Hi John,

I hear your anger at the injustice of it all. It occurred to me that you might get something from my recent articles: "Mechanisms of Escape from Freedom" and "Seeking Solutions to the 'World Problematique." The psychology of what's happening is, in my opinion, an important dimension in understanding what's going down.

Best Wishes.

Submitted on Thursday, Aug 27, 2020 at 7:06:07 PM

  Recommend  (2+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?

Art Costa

Become a Fan
Author 48718
(Member since May 19, 2010), 3 fans, 1094 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

  New Content

When the MIC, and there cohorts (which today includes big tech) assassinated JFK they put in motion a junta that, as John Lawrence Re notes is in control to this day. Presidents are just front men. The most recent scheme has been reported on by Whitney Webb. Dean should read it or get a new gig. He has no understanding of real power. From Whitney Webb click here

Submitted on Tuesday, Aug 25, 2020 at 8:14:20 PM

  Recommend  (5+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?

Tom Calarco

Become a Fan
Author 506489
(Member since Aug 29, 2016), 1 fan, 4 articles, 185 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Facebook Page Twitter Page Linked In Page Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

  New Content

I think it would be better to print the transcript of the interview rather than to print these notes, which to me were confusing (That would take some doing unless you have a voice to text translator). I guess I will have to watch the interview. However, just the fact that Dean, of all people, is fearing the autocracy of Trump, says something. It shows how far to the right the Republican Party has moved since Nixon.

Submitted on Thursday, Aug 27, 2020 at 12:50:43 PM

  Recommend  (2+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?
Indent

Maxwell

Become a Fan
Author 4952
(Member since Feb 15, 2007), 2 fans, 4375 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

Reply to Tom Calarco:   New Content

Transcripts do appear sometimes, but they require labor. Voice to text translations still frequently result in outright belly laughs (one of the predictions for 1984 Orwell got terribly wrong).

I finally sat down and listened to about 2/3 of it. Well worth the time. Will listen to the rest later.

Submitted on Thursday, Aug 27, 2020 at 4:19:02 PM

  Recommend  (0+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?

Maxwell

Become a Fan
Author 4952
(Member since Feb 15, 2007), 2 fans, 4375 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

  New Content

One thing Dean notes, that I've been saying for a long time, is Trump has shown the way for someone smarter to become the next Hitler in this country, unless structural changes are made. Unless traditions upheld by presidents in good faith, like making tax returns public, are codified into a law. Norms, which Trump famously shatters, are ill prepared to deal with a bad faith actor like Trump. The archaic "foreign emoluments clause of the constitution doesn't cover a tenth of the self-dealing Trump has done.

Submitted on Thursday, Aug 27, 2020 at 4:12:51 PM

  Recommend  (0+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?

Blair Gelbond

Become a Fan
Author 71296
(Member since Sep 8, 2011), 4 fans, 27 articles, 341 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Not paid member and Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Not paid member and Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Not paid member and Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in Not paid member and Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

  New Content

This interview is a gem.

I found Dean's book Conservatives Without Conscience to be both analytically sound and very insightful.

I also learned a great deal from Erich Fromm's Escape From Freedom and wrote about it in my recent article - "Mechanisms of Escape from Freedom." I see benefit arising from Fromm's related take on a psychological understanding re- authoritarian followers and leaders: specifically the qualities of sadism, masochism, destructiveness and "automaton conformity."

Submitted on Thursday, Aug 27, 2020 at 6:59:12 PM

  Recommend  (0+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?

Lois Gagnon

Become a Fan
Author 61784
(Member since Mar 21, 2011), 42 fans, 1 articles, 15 quicklinks, 5664 comments (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

  New Content

I see Trump as one branch of rotten fruit on a tree full of rotten fruit. You may hack off that branch, but more will grow in it's place producing even more rotten fruit. The tree must be yanked out by the roots.

I see far too many people so triggered by Trump's lunacy that they will form alliances with some of the worst war criminals this country has produced. John Negroponte (Mr. death squad) comes to mind. While Trump has people distracted, the Washington neoliberal establishment is busy solidifying its plans for ramping up tensions with those countries that have resisted being absorbed into compliant imperial outposts. Our outlook for the future will not improve until we toss the whole lot of them out on their greedy psychopathic butts.

Submitted on Thursday, Aug 27, 2020 at 7:00:37 PM

  Recommend  (5+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?

Gary Brumback

Become a Fan
Author 72187
Follow Me on Twitter (Member since Oct 1, 2011), 36 fans, 83 articles, 1446 comments, 1 diaries (How many times has this commenter been recommended?)
Not paid member and Facebook page url on login Profile not filled in Not paid member and Twitter page url on login Profile not filled in Not paid member and Linkedin page url on login Profile not filled in Not paid member and Instagram page url on login Profile not filled in

  New Content

Rob, you sure did deservedly unleash a torrent of comments, all more insightful than your article I am sorry to say, because I like you despite the widening gulf between us in our understanding of why America is what it has always been and our prescriptions for the future.

As one commenter incisively remarked, US presidents are front men, namely, for the war and oil industries but also for all the rest of corporate America's power elite. In my book, "911!" I thoroughly dissect as a psychologist/historian the true nature of America's presidents, all of them. Here they are:

Their genes and gender; human disconnectedness; psychopathic personality as exhibited in lack of empathy, lack of remorse, beguiling charm, arrogance, risk takers, con artists; their deep immorality underlying evilness and evil doing; ambitiousness; smart and cunning; their rationalizing beliefs such as in America's manifesto destiny; and their upbringing. Put all these undesirable ingredients into a pot, stir and cook and what do you get? Another US president. A criminal cretin.

And Rob what I have to say next may boil you. If you vote for Biden you get what you deserve. If you could only take an objective and thorough look at Trump you will see that all his faults pale in comparison to his predecessors, even Abe, believe it or not, who, through his racist bent and desire to keep the nation united and strong enough so as to fend off any foreign invasions and to acquire the rest of the nation's land, deliberately started the American Revolution that killed more Americans than in any of the rest of America's wars and military operations around the world. Or take Obomba. He reportedly once said to his inner sanctum plotting the next drone kills that he didn't realize how easy it was to kill people---now that epitomizes a bona fide criminal psychopath. Trump has been the only president wily and smart enough to tame the deep state by cleverly giving them a carrot now and then.

Submitted on Friday, Aug 28, 2020 at 12:08:58 PM

  Recommend  (4+)
Flag This
Share Comment More Sharing          
Commenter Blocking?