I spoke with Congressman Dennis Kucinich because a rumor was gaining traction that:
"Before the Nevada primary, Dennis was visited by representatives of Nancy Pelosi and the American Israel Public Affairs Committee — AIPAC. They told Dennis that if he would drop his campaigns to impeach Cheney and Bush, they would guarantee his re-election to the House of Representatives. Kucinich threw them out of his office."
According to Kucinich, "The incident did not happen."
I find the Congressman's denial of the incident entirely credible. The rumor was supposedly based on the word of someone high up in his presidential campaign. But there is nobody who fits that description other than the Congressman or his wife. And campaign staff are not typically in congressional offices where congress members are forbidden to work on campaigns. It is doubtful that if such an incident had occurred, any campaign staff would have seen it or been told about it. It is also doubtful it would have occured. Pelosi's office would not bring AIPAC along or vice versa. And AIPAC has long known that Kucinich doesn't give a damn what they think. Also, Kucinich would never throw Pelosi or her "representative" out of his office.
The rumor caught on, I think, because Kucinich had planned to introduce articles of impeachment against Bush on the day of the State of the Union and then changed his mind. He did so because of the attacks he is under in his primary election in Cleveland, where the corporate media that has long opposed him paints national issues as in conflict with providing services to constituents. The election will consume Kucinich's time for the next few weeks, but he has not dropped his plans to eventually introduce the articles of impeachment. He has not withdrawn his resolution to impeach the Vice President. He has not dropped his opposition to the occupation of Iraq.
Of course, Pelosi opposes impeachment. But she usually delegates her thuggery to members of her leadership team. She and her team would no doubt prefer to replace Kucinich with a DLC-style corporate Democrat, even though such a candidate might lose the general election. And there is every reason to believe that AIPAC feels the same way. I would not be at all surprised if a list of AIPAC's biggest donors and a list of donors to the campaign of Kucinich's most heavily funded challenger, Joe Cimperman, had some names in common. AIPAC would never be satisfied with a mere 400 or so loyal congress members. It would want to shutdown any opposition to the current U.S. policy in the Middle East, and it would want to protect Dick Cheney.
But I believe Kucinich's denial that the rumored incident took place.
I also believe that the U.S. Congress would be a much worse place without Kucinich in it, and I encourage everyone to support his reelection campaign right away at http://kucinich.us
http://www.davidswanson.org
DAVID SWANSON is a co-founder of After Downing Street, a writer and activist, and the Washington Director of Democrats.com. He is a board member of Progressive Democrats of America, and serves on the Executive Council of the Washington-Baltimore Newspaper Guild, TNG-CWA. He has worked as a newspaper reporter and as a communications director, with jobs including Press Secretary for Dennis Kucinich's 2004 presidential campaign, Media Coordinator for the International Labor Communications Association, and three years as Communications Coordinator for ACORN, the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now. Swanson obtained a Master's degree in philosophy from the University of Virginia in 1997.
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Nadia is an online activist interested in using the miracle of the internet to save our country before it is too late. |
so what's the real truth? I didn't exactly believe the rumor, but what's going on here? Kucinich said Conyers convinced him to wait two weeks and he would act. It has now been two weeks and now we are told that he dropped Impeachment because of his re-election bid and we should just wait? I think someone is lying here about what is going on, and I for one am tired of being led on by so called leaders. First Conyers, now Kucinich. It is absurd to give the excuse that Impeachment will hurt his re-election. It is what the Constitution calls for and what the majority of the American people want. Who cares what the Corporate media will say, give the people a little credit. How many times is Kucinich planning on letting his supporters down. This is weak and pathetic. by
Nadia (4 articles, 0 quicklinks, 2 diaries, 49 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 9:58:34 AM
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Nadia is an online activist interested in using the miracle of the internet to save our country before it is too late. |
Is this excuse straight from Kucinich? This is what he posted on his website after leading everyone on two weeks ago. This seemed like a lie at the time, because if he decided after that meeting, why did he wait until the day of the State of the Union to tell everyone, many of whom were glued to C-SPAN in anticipation. "After making a statement on the floor of the House of Representatives last week indicating my intent to introduce articles of impeachment against George W. Bush, I met with members of the Judiciary Committee. After that brief meeting, I am hopeful there will be an inquiry by the Judiciary Committee. I will give them the opportunity to proceed before introducing articles of impeachment." by
Nadia (4 articles, 0 quicklinks, 2 diaries, 49 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 10:12:08 AM
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Faculty member at University of Kentucky. Teacher, Researcher, social activist. Political independent who believes in better government, not necessarily smaller or larger government. |
Kucinich -- The incident did not happen Thank you. I am glad you did a fact check on this and the other side is now presented. It is good to hear Pelosi is not as bad as I thought she might be. Whether Peolsi dislikes Kucinich or not is okay. I would be far more concerned if she used her influence to facilitate Kucinich's removal from office. As she apparently seems not to have gone that far, I feel much more relieved. Meanwhile, you have taught us an extremely important lesson -- Don't assume what is written on this site is CORRECT. We all need to be vigilent about fact-checking it first before responding to these articles. The OpEd editor cannot do the fact checking on the budget he has, so that remains our obligation. Thank you for reminding me of this. It will not soon be forgotten. by
Peter Wedlund (2 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 127 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 11:00:08 AM
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Nadia is an online activist interested in using the miracle of the internet to save our country before it is too late. |
off topic but... I billed his campaign $38,000.00 What did you do for the campaign?? by
Nadia (4 articles, 0 quicklinks, 2 diaries, 49 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 2:47:45 PM
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Righton Roncorvus! And Ron Paul is the Kucinich of the GOP. Kucinich dropped his presidential bid the day after registration for GOP ended, so if you wanted to vote for Ron Paul in the primary and cast a peace vote, you couldn't; GOP closed their ballots to members only. But Ron Paul, is no better, like Kucinich he has a great plan..I love Paul's better than Kucinichs personally, but the GOP would never go for it. I'm getting "testimonials" from GOP Ran Paul supporters telling me that since they joined the GOP, since the GOP is AWOL from Bush, they are able to pass GOP platforms, like GOP in Alaska was passed because of GOP Ton Paul supporters Industrial Hemp is Legal. Yes, I think this is happening. And it's worth looking into, don't you think? by
Jeanette Doney (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 6 diaries, 304 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 8:24:46 PM
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JUST A CONCERN CITIZEN AND LOVE MY COUNTRY GREW UP IN A SMALL FISHING TOWN IN NJ,BUT THE DAY I GOT MY DRIVERS LICENSE,SPENT MOST OF MY TIME EXPANSING MY MINE. LEARNED A LOT THE HARD WAY,BUT MOSTLY STREET SMART. AT 65 HAVE PRETTY GOOD IDEA WHO THE SNAKES ARE. |
TELL IT LIKE IT IS AGREE AGREE THERE IS ONLY ONE PARTY, SO WHERE IS ANY CHANGE GOING TO COME FROM, THEY ALL ACT LIKE THEY ARE ABOVE THE LAW. WE THE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE THE CHANGE WHEN ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. by
RICHARD SHADE (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 459 comments)
on Tuesday, February 12, 2008 at 7:30:16 AM
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Author of NotSee America - The Key to Reviving Our Democracy and administrator of NotSee America Blog at http://notseeamerica.com.
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Kucinich Should Be Admired The truth is Kucinich is a threat to the political machinery that has taken over the United States, you either join the ranks or they dispose of you, politically or otherwise. For example let's look at Cynthia McKinney. She vehemently campaigned to have the mass murders of 9/11 investigated by an independent council. She was buried in her reelection bid. Then there is Max Clelland. He was initially named to the 9/11 Commission, but when he made the statement the American People are being scammed, he was not only taken off the Commission, but was also buried in his reelection bid. Tom Daschle. Senator Daschle pushed initially for an independent commission to investigate 9/11, then he threatened to go against the USA PATRIOT Act. He was first anthraxed, then buried in his reelection bid. Paul Wellstone. He was warned by Dick Cheney that if he voted against giving Bush authority to go to war against Iraq he could face “serious consequences” for himself or his state. We know what happened to Senator Wellstone. Other examples of those not “going with the program” can be cited, but I believe the point has been made – The people have lost control of the United States of America, there are longer two distinct parties, the are no longer three meaningful Branches of government leaving no checks and balances. The Democracy we have grown up is no longer with us. Kucinich attempted to tell this to the people, but the politicos using their corporate media propagandists had to silence him before too many people heard what he had to say. Has anyone stopped to consider that none of the existing candidates talk about reconstructing our Constitution, fixing the process of government with Executive, Legislative, and Judicial Branches each assuming the roles they were intended, unprivatizing our voting system, or a host of other things that would restore our Democracy? They all say they will “change” things, but those “things” do not include restoring Democracy. Kucinich did talk of such, and was silenced. The important thing is once a new Administration takes over, if our system is not restored it will be lost forever. If that occurs George W. Bush could truly be called “The Father of the New America” for the Democracy we knew was taken from us by him. None of the existing candidates comes close to discussing this. They do not even mention the Security and Prosperity Partnership, forming a “union” between Canada, Mexico, and the United States will occur in 2010. Kucinich stated he would have us out of NAFTA. Shame on him for defying the powers that pull the strings. Kucinich should be praised. He will be buried in his reelection bid, but he will have his self-dignity and the admiration of people who understand what is taking place in America. by
Dennis Kaiser (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 1 diaries, 18 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 12:02:32 PM
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I'm supporting Dennis Kucinich for President. |
Maybe Maybe the incident did happen but is unable to admit it for whatever reason. by
Ty Shlackman (0 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 583 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 1:14:32 PM
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Tom Storey is a father of two with 5 unproduced feature film screenplays to his credit. At age 17, he canvassed the precincts of Newport, Rhode Island on behalf of presidential candidate George McGovern. Tom Has been known to blog supportively for Ron Paul. Tom has spent a life in business. |
The real truth is that the world is loaded with Disinformation. On the net, proper journalistic practice is not followed by "posters" and "bloggers." If you worked for a newspaper and you brought that story to the editor, it would not have been published...why? What the hell were the sources? It is called professional credibility. The editor would require at least more than one source and the source would have to "sign off" on the information. No, not use their name, but, the reporter would have to actually talk to the human being who was "at" the "event" being reported on. Many of the people who post here simply read a blog and carry it around as if it was the truth. When a person spreads this type of information they are acting as an agent for those who desire to spread DISinformation. The more malinformed and confused the public the better....for those who desire control. The internet independent newsphere is packed with disinfo specialists. Usually 95% true and 5% lies. Please don't believe anything I say. Research your self and remember, the stuff you research is also potentially full of lies. Here is an exmaple of a "hot" story from the internet. Now, I am going to say that it lacks credibilty for basic reasons. You must, as a journalist, research and make your own conclusions. Sibel Edmonds is a person who is making "claims." These claims have been trumpeted throughout the internet as true. Do some research and define how this person would have the information she claims to have. Then carefully check who is spreading here "information" for her. Horrors! You might actually have to do some work! Am I a journalist? No, I do not have the time or resources to go and do proper research. I am a commentator.Once I think I am close to then truth I present my view with the support of as much truth as I can get from events. Am I full of it? Probably, but at least I admit it. by
tom storey (3 articles, 0 quicklinks, 2 diaries, 58 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 2:43:10 PM
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Nadia is an online activist interested in using the miracle of the internet to save our country before it is too late. |
I know I am still wondering... Did Kucinich really put off Impeachment because of the Corporate media?The way you fight them is to stand up to them, not do what they want. That is so lame I don't want to believe it. The Corporate media does not represent the 'mainstream'. We need to stop giving them the power they do not deserve. by
Nadia (4 articles, 0 quicklinks, 2 diaries, 49 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 2:52:40 PM
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What you say is entirely true .. and that said, it still very very easy to spread these stories and quite frankly there is so much of it about who knows what to believe. The version appeared on a usually reliable impeachment source as an "exclusive" - if Dennis is NOT, and he is NOT, keeping up with communicating with those who support him than we will necessarily jump at any impeachment news. We want impeachment - so "checking" the facts is not always the first thing on your mind. I called Kucinich's office about the fundraising going on on the internet and where the stories were posted - and no, I did not get a call back. I put my neck out to help get one Congressman in the House of Representatives who appears to be dependable. But refusing to call back when I posted on the No.1 blog, with MY Name on it, in all of blogger seems to me sort of irresponsibile. I caled them on MY dime, too. IS he dependable? I don't know - but I've read other allegations of him being self serving elsewhere. Dennis filed H Res 333 and we can use that. It was a good thing, but to expect that we are to use one leader against Fearless Leader is a nonstarter. I've been very upset to see Consitution-waving Ron Paul NOT pursue impeachment. Are we ALL being used?? The new attack to go get arrest warrants through the individual states seems a good idea for impeachment groups to try = Rumsfield sought protection in a US embassey in France, or so I have read. IT's getting quite late although there is no statute of limitations on war crimes. The thing is why were not the lawyers banging on about that from the off? There are plenty of Federal violations already apparent - the Presidential Records Act to name but one. There is currenly no ONE authoritative voice from which to get on going updated information, is there?? The entire Iway is abuzz with news of coming martial law . I've read the plans for years and certain details (IDs required on planes is an example) cry to be addressed, but how is one to know if there would be enough forces to implement for THEM. People are frightened and begging for real verifiable news which the MSM does NOT provide - so us ciitizen journalists do the best we can. As for reporting the "AIPAC, NANCY PELOSI" story - why would one NOT believe it? And why would I NOT distribute it without or without checking? There is lieing everywhere . I'd rather make a fool out of myself being wrong than to do nothing at all. Funny it was "leaked" just before the push for money came. And interestingly, at the very same time, a letter has been circulated that Ron Paul has given up the effort - via an email to his supporters, saying he is going to hang onto his seat - but what happens to all those MILLIONS of dollars? People did NOT give them to him to have a well financed race for the House in Texas. I'll tell you - people are sick of being PLAYED. Does he give them their money back? Or is that another "rumor"?? And incidentally, I was tipped off on the story about AIPAC nancy pelosi by a Ron Paul fundraiser. Again, I urge OpEd News readers to google this and read it - and THINK ABOUT IT ALAN STANG RED DOT BLOWBACK Can the threats be any clearer?? Funny that these lawyers who want to see war crimes prosecuted and justice done aren't stumping up money to Dennis to see that a real campaign for impeachment isn't being done, isn't it? To make this more graphic - I find it totally TRAGIC that Dick Cheney and BuZh get away with the massive crimes committeed. I am sick to death of a two-tiered justice system. I am VERY alarmed by the current Attorney General of the United State's ignoring international law. I am worried what HiLIARy will do with all those signing statements and executive orders. I am worried who will have TOP SECRET security clearances in 2009. I wonder why no US news sources at all will pick up the Sibel story and run with it. I wonder why Hills and Bill's cohort Frank Guistra is not a front page item. I wonder if Norman Hsu could have turned state's evidence. I wonder why no one covers the Peter F. Paul story. See, I wonder wonder wonder if we all turn out to be GLOW WORMS, caught in the middle of an internet war, while crooks in CONgress get away with INFLUENCE PEDDLING day after day after day. I am afraid that if we do not get a sane energy policy everyone on this planet is TOAST. I've done some research on my own about Sibel and the Turkish arms and drug dealing. It is verifiable. I've used European sources to look at the Prince Badar and BAE story and I found on the BBC has been shocking. We race around every single day forgetting to look back and update the OLD stories. The crime and corruption is so thick it is a laugh to think anyone person could keep track of it ALL. So no one should be pointing fingers at those who "bought the story" about AIPAC and Dennis. Citizen journalists have as much right to make mistakes and print retractions as any one in the MSM, eh?? I get plagarized, plagarized, plagarized .. that story was lifted off my site by a radio station and flogged by THEM. I wonder what they think now. I see Google in Mountain View come in and cherry pick my items every single day by following the info on my site meter!! i don't think they run them through a fact checker!! They just post them for the world to see. A story goes viral very very quickly. And people should know that. If Dennis wants to clarify, he should post himself on here. I ain't taking David Swanson's word for it nor anyone else's and to excuse Dennis for not communicating directly is about as silly as taking Ron Paul's word he didn't write those sexist, racist materials for years without checking it out. I wonder who the blamee will be in this case!! In Ron Paul's case it was Lew Rockwell. Who ever will it turn out to be in this case?? And what will the "payoff" have been for someone who planted it if it is false. I think it's time that Dennis SPOKE instead of leaving HONEST people like me in the lurch. I subscribed to his announcements via businesswire so that things were verifiable - but NO WORK has come out on any of this. I think it's time it did. Let's get it ALL straight and no more guessing games. by
ladybroadoak (37 articles, 20 quicklinks, 12 diaries, 390 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 6:44:11 PM
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Tom, you and I are kindred spirits here.,. I routinely tell people who challenge me that if my logic doesnt make sense and the items I post as fact cannot be verified, dont believe me. Of course, I put a lot of links to citations in my articles and comments to back up my assertions, but if my logic doesnt speak to people, dont believe me. I chuckle at people who write me saying "who are you and why should I believe you?". I always answer, "you shouldnt". Again, if what I say doesnt make sense and cannot be verified, why would you believe me or anyone else? Would you believe someone who wrote for the NY Times or some other such major news media more because of where they write if their logic doesnt make sense or their assertions cannot be verified? by
Steven Leser (189 articles, 35 quicklinks, 32 diaries, 1263 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 11:57:57 PM
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Kucinich is unique, and that's a compliment Of course, another way of saying it is that he thinks out of the box. And in my way of thinking he belongs in the House just where he is. Since he went to school and has some idea of how political communication works, he is not naive either. I saw more issues than peace/antiWar, whichever way to approach the subject. I do not see Kucinich as having domestic issues as clearly outlined. So I would not have put him in serious running for President. That having been said, he does perform valuable leadership where we sorely need it--admitting a need to get government back to people-friendly positions. I hadn't heard the rumor you write about. I'll refer anyone who tries to make an issue out of it to you who have some knowledge of it. by
Margaret Bassett (19 articles, 1113 quicklinks, 24 diaries, 615 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 4:20:27 PM
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Michael Collins is a writer who focuses on clean elections and voting rights. See this summary of his articles plus Election 2004: The Urban Legend and groundbreaking research and commentary in "" His web site, Election Fraud News & The Money Party, offers a collection of resources and commentary on critical issues facing the country. |
Kucinich and the primary challenge & thanks for this! David, thanks for this clarification. I hadn't even heard the rumor but I'll know to toss it entirely if it comes up. The real danger to Kucinich is the primary challege. They picked someone who is close to Dennis on the issues, at least close enough, and who has some base. In other words, someone who might just win, the day after that snow ball survives Hell. Cuyahoga County is one of the key locations of the 2004 election theft. Oddly, it's a county controlleld by Democrats. That didn't matter in 2004, nor did it wheln a federal judge ordered ballots returned which he'd ordered preserved. Cuyahoga lost then found a huge chunk of evidence discrediting any clams to a credible election. If you lose the ballots, how do you know what you found? Strange things happen in Ohio elections. Watch for this primary to be very strange. I'd be surprised but not by much if the challenger wins based on the lies put forth already - people are upset by his absence form Congress, etc. This was the opening salvo. It's a lie but selling his "defeat" will become easier. There is no reason to think he's doing anything other than recognizing political realities. I hope he crushes the challenger and returns to Congress demanding hearings on war crimes. by
Michael Collins (81 articles, 11 quicklinks, 5 diaries, 289 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 7:41:20 PM
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Laurie Dobson is a writer, planner, mother, gardener, anti-war activist and caregiver who is FEC registered, running in the 2008 for the US Senate as an Independent Candidate in Maine.
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recognizing political realities? This argument on behalf of Dennis doesn't stand on scrutiny. If he recognized that he had to attend to his own race, he should acknowledge this. It's truth. We cannot afford excuses or ambiguous statements. Nor can we afford Nancy Pelosi any more as Leader of the House, not if we all are seriously engaged in this impeachment battle. She does not stand for accountability. There is no discussion about how to make sure the next President doesn't assume these powers. The concern here is the division of powers. I could respect a statement from Kucinich saying that he intends for this to be a fight he carries on for the long term, that he sees the short term focus shifting to a longer term effort. Then at least, the people would not be scrambling for explanations and excuses. Dennis you must speak up. Pelosi has her own impeachable offenses potentially, with her pre-knowledge of waterboarding and torture. Is this what you are protecting by obfuscations and expressions of friendship for her? You must distinuguish yourself here. You are losing your voice and it is all you have. History will not be selective, you will stand or fall on your leadership NOW. Laurie Dobson by
laurie dobson (2 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 11 comments)
on Tuesday, February 12, 2008 at 11:45:04 AM
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Hater of Nazis above all. Hobbies include activism, military model building, military history, exciting and vital conversation with retired crooks. Retired |
Mayhbe it's time to start thinking WAY outside of the box. I think it is time to think about getting rid of representative government. Direct voting isn't perfect, but it might lead to an eventual government by little crooks instead of the big ones we have today. Direct voting would make the "politicians" appeal to the public directly instead of through crook media. Just think about it. Do you know that our representatives don't even read the ponderous bills that they pass today? Kucinich was much better than average, but no one can read the legalistic garbage that is put forth today. by
John Hanks (1 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 859 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 7:52:26 PM
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I did my duty ... and called Conyers office today and basically it came down to this Thursday as "the" meeting concerning impeachment. I stressed my belief that perhaps we're way past the "meeting" stage now that Mob Lawyer Muck-a-case' has rubbed our collective faces into the ashes of what's left of Constitutional Law and since Rep. Conyers has written a book on impeaching these s.o.b.'s and it's his sworn obligation to do so he might start impeaching someone, anyone, as some as possible. But I'm not holding my breath. Ron Corvus is right about Kucinich. And I And it's amazing how the majority of We the People have been fooled into willfully giving-up our power. Case in point, today listening to callers on C-SPAN a caller says, " ... I'm Independent, because I vote both Democratic and Republican ..." without ever realizing what she was saying. If you vote for either Democratic or Republican candidates you're not "independent". So powers-that-be have basically made "Independent" voters disappear by only giving us Tweedledee or TweedleDum to choose from, but if the true number of Independents out here were to realize their power and vote such we'd have representation we could be happy with. That's why Kucinich is a liar, he has to realize just how corrupt the system is by now and to remain faithful to either compromised party would be impossible and remain principled. Not that any Green, Libertarian or any of the other 3rd parties could not be corrupted either, but it would take some time. But it's no mystery our current system is a joke. Most other democracies have more than just two major parties - it's a lot easier to buy-off two parties as opposed to twenty. And to think we have corporate networks, whose corporate pundits tell us who are the "winners" and "losers" are before we even get to cast a vote on machines that may erase it anyway as we run around the world proclaiming ourselves a "model of democracy" must somehow win an award somewhere for one of the all-time ironies in human history. But, don't worry about a thing, absolutely nothing is going to change for the better. This Thursday will come and go with Conyers giving us even more incredibly insanely inept reasons that he won't be able to explain any better than the last batch of witlessly inane reasons he gave the last time we pressed him, and the time before that, and the time before ... on why we have to "wait" some more to see justice. Count on it. But let me add, I would be the first one on Friday posting my sincere apologies if come this time next week Conyers has announced he's pursuing impeachment proceedings - with a smile and a bottle of champagne. I would never be so happy to be so wrong in my life! by
Mr M (4 articles, 0 quicklinks, 5 diaries, 1059 comments)
on Monday, February 11, 2008 at 10:56:41 PM
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Laurie Dobson is a writer, planner, mother, gardener, anti-war activist and caregiver who is FEC registered, running in the 2008 for the US Senate as an Independent Candidate in Maine.
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Your higher duty I suggest that all people professing to being purists refrain from vacillating between despair and elation and, as I said before, join the effort to change the system right NOW. You cannot simultaneously denounce those who throw in the towel and do so yourselves! Your own equivocation is part of the problem. No, if you want to work for change, do it the honest way. Stop delaying and do something to immediately change the system. Support an Independent Candidate. This race has the potential to shift the Congress in the direction of a viable third party system. Join my effort to elect a non-corporate, pro-impeachment, anti-war, pro-Constitution Independent for US Senate! Laurie Dobson Maine's Independent for US Senate volunteer, contact, or DONATE at: www.dobsonforsenate.com (type in the www). thank you! by
laurie dobson (2 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 11 comments)
on Tuesday, February 12, 2008 at 11:55:24 AM
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I think a lot of the AIPAC, CFR, Bildberger conspiracy stuff ... posted here is just as much BS as this turned out to be. It has never been persuasive to me, the logic of it was non-existent and no assertions are verifiable. All conspiracy theories concerning the above groups ultimately boil down to "Well, everyone knows they are xyz" by
Steven Leser (189 articles, 35 quicklinks, 32 diaries, 1263 comments)
on Tuesday, February 12, 2008 at 12:00:24 AM
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I see ... so these groups exist for what reason than? To get together to play Bridge? If not to formulate policy for them to shuffle the world around and treat us like so many chess pieces, what are all these families and groups, who are more powerful than countries, doing at their meetings? It's only human nature. Put yourself in this position, let's go back say 1,500 years and you're one of the clever and ruthless ones to have gained control and power over the peasants. What would you do over generations? As the world became smaller and you butted heads with others of your ilk wouldn't it be natural for you to form an alliance with other powerful clans to ensure that you continue to have a stranglehold on all that there is to sustain life and keep the masses at bay? History is fraught with conspiracy. Have you never read Shakespeare? Are you that naive to believe that those that have massive control wouldn't do everything in their power to retain what they have? Are you completely ignorant of documentation backing-up shadow governments, agreements and alliances that benefit the few at the expense of the many? Have you read anything about "Black-ops false flag" operations that have changed the course of history that could of only come from such conspiracies you seem not to wish to see? Why must a supposed open government have meetings cloaked in secrecy? Do you think cheney refused to let us know who he meet with to form our energy policy because it was for our best interests? I think it's time you pulled your head out of ... ah, the ground, and perhaps read some books. by
Mr M (4 articles, 0 quicklinks, 5 diaries, 1059 comments)
on Tuesday, February 12, 2008 at 10:22:57 AM
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Again, that is very poor logic if that is an attempt to prove your point. "What other purpose could those groups serve". Is that really what you think serves as proof? The sad thing about this is that there are real evil people in powerful positions who should be fought against, not these silly inconsequential groups. Bush, Cheney and the neocons are the ones who deserve all of our fight and ire. |