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VB: Well, there's no question that independent of Obama, Holder has the authority to bring criminal charges against Bush, no question about it. There's also no question that each of the 93 U.S. attorneys around the country have the power and the authority to do so, but let's jump from there to reality. The reality is if there's some U.S. attorney in Chicago that wants to do it, it's possible, but he's not going to do it without checking with his boss. You don't take on the biggest most important murder case in American history without letting your boss know about it, you know -- that is, not if you want to remain a U.S. attorney; and likewise with Holder. He has the authority and he has the power to completely ignore Obama, but the reality is what do you do? If Obama indicated that he was opposed to it, it would take quite a man to overrule the president.
MC: Where does that leave the cause of justice for those who died?
Since Obama's not going to do anything and the International Criminal Court has no jurisdiction, the reality is that the only game in town is what took place several weeks ago up in Seattle when Bob Alexander, just a regular citizen, but an American patriot, sent out with volunteers, copies of my book, The Prosecution of George Bush for Murder, to DAs all over the country, with a cover letter from me, asking the DAs to read the book, and, if they agreed that the evidence of guilt was clear and that there's jurisdiction to proceed against him, I offered to help out in any way that I could, any way that they deemed -- any way that they wanted me to, which would range all the way from being a consultant up to and including being appointed as special prosecutor.
" -- although I may not succeed, I'm not going to be satisfied until I see George Bush in an American courtroom being prosecuted for first degree murder. George Bush cannot be permitted to get away with murder. I realize my biggest obstacle is the perceptive observation made by Mark Twain: "Why is physical courage so common, but moral courage so very rare?" Cover letter for distribution of Bugliosi's book to 2200 local prosecutors,
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MC: I've followed Professor Jonathon Turley of George Washington University, and he's come out and said there are two clear crimes to prosecute Bush for. One is torture, which Bush has essentially admitted, and the other is under the statutes against illegal surveillance. I'm trying to understand why Turley doesn't -- and I don't know if you've talked to him or not --
VB: No, no.
MC: I'm trying to understand where the murder charge is.
VB: I told you that I was disappointed with Obama. I have to take it a step further and say I am offended. I am offended by this movement by those who want to get, quote, even with Bush to just talk about torture. I find it very offensive. And I'll tell you why. I'm not saying that Bush and his people should not be prosecuted for torture, but I want to get into that in depth in a while. But it should only be at most a footnote to going after him for murder. It should only be a footnote.
The New York Times said in an editorial a month and a half or so ago that there were two dozen verifiable cases of torture at Abu Ghraib. Let's assume that that number is very conservative, very conservative. Let's say there's 100 cases; let's say there's 200 cases of torture that can be verified.
How do you compare 200 cases of torturing Iraqis with the unlawful death, if what I say is correct, of one million Iraqis and 4,200 American soldiers? How do you compare these two? Again, is there something that I don't know? Is there something that I have to be told? How do you compare the two?
They can't be compared, obviously, and yet all I hear is torture, torture, torture, torture, and I'm offended by that, not because I'm not saying that Bush shouldn't be prosecuted for torture, but because what's wrong with these people? To give Bush a free pass on taking this nation to war on a lie. The majority of American people believe that Bush took this nation to war on a lie, and I can't tell you the number of times there's been TV and radio shows and articles about the lies of the Bush administration in taking this nation to war. Now all of a sudden they want to forget all about that, these people, and just talk about torture, torture, torture, torture.
There was a cover story in, I think it was Harper's Magazine about two months ago, about prosecuting Bush. Obviously, I bought the magazine, and I opened it up to the prosecution. What was it all about? Torture . The New York Times had a pro and con in the op-ed section about two months ago, pro prosecution to Bush, anti prosecution to Bush. So I looked at what the prosecution was about -- torture. I'm offended by this.
Who's fighting to bring about justice for the perhaps one million innocent Iraqi men, women, and children and babies in their graves? Actually, I shouldn't say I'm going to bring about justice for them, or try to, because I was unable to establish jurisdiction to go after Bush for the deaths of the Iraqi citizens. I did establish jurisdiction to go after him for the deaths of the 4,200 American soldiers. In any event, it would be a symbolic effort to bring about justice for the million people in their graves. Let's say that number's high. In my book I say over 100,000. Certainly there's over 100,000 innocent Iraqi men, women, children and babies who died as a result of Bush's war. Some numbers put it in excess of one million, and we know there's 4,200 American soldiers.
Who's fighting to bring about justice for those in their graves, decomposing in their cold graves right now as I'm talking to you, Michael? Who's doing that out there?
