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April 23, 2008 at 12:01:54

Failed Conservative Values Stories: Violence and Brutality

by Edwin Rutsch     Page 2 of 3 page(s)

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Answer: The conservative side has always been in opposition to the evolution towards a human and civilized integrated kind of society. They are almost diametrically opposed, despite what they say. So I don’t know how much sharper I can draw them.

Lynch Mob Definition
- a mob that kills a person for some presumed offense without legal authority

Progressive Values: Herman Blackmon on Justice

My name is Herman Blackmon.  I've been on the central committee since  2000, prior to that I was active on the Hercules City Council as a member, as Vice Mayor for one term and as Mayor. 

Like most terms, progressive becomes somewhat hackneyed.  It means different things to different people.  For me, having been in politics ever since I can remember  back to the time I was a paperboy delivering the Houston Chronicle, it’s been pretty clear to me what progressive means, primarily as an African-American, to make progress in the real world, racial progress.

So if you can be progressive in that sense you pretty much can be progressive in most other senses of that word, economically, certainly socially, and politically.  More specifically, if you want talk about political progressivism, I believe that you’ve got to be willing to integrate and incorporate other cultures into your party.

I don’t know if you recall the 1964 convention which marked my beginning with progressive Democrats.  They weren’t seated by the regular blue-dog rightwing white racist Democrats out of the South.  And for a long time, that group has prevailed.  But for some reason there’s been a resurgence of reactionary elements within the Democratic Party.

Edwin:  In one word, would the value be diversity?

Answer:  More than that, I think it’s justice.  One word might be too much of a distillation – maybe social justice across the entire spectrum that a society by definition must be made of.  Certainly social justice, economic justice, full employment.

As a child, in Houston, which during the 50’s was very segregated and a very unjustly treated black community, and so I can recall long periods of strife, when the NAACP was always raising money at church to provide legal services for a black man who had somehow run afoul of white law, which was by definition unjust, because it had a duty to uphold the colored-white separation.  And every Sunday we were collecting to defend a black who was about to be railroaded through the racist criminal justice system.

Specifically, I remember around 1955 the Johnny Lee Marlees, where a black man was sentenced to die ultimately for killing a white bus driver, because he attempted to force him out of the all-white seats to give the seat to a white man or woman.  Incidents like that mark for me, they are riveting.

Edwin:   Were you personally involved?

Answer:  Well, he was a black man, and by definition. 

 I saw how people had to react and how they often had to go to extraordinary methods just to make sure that a black man received justice.  So by definition it has to be a willingness to include social justice and justice within the criminal justice system for everyone, because there’s a great deal of prejudice in that system.

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my Bio here
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Edwin Rutschmy Bio here
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criminals

Are criminals that lack empathy for their victims and that use violence conservatives?

by Edwin Rutsch (61 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 151 comments) on Wednesday, April 23, 2008 at 12:56:21 PM
 


my Bio here
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Edwin Rutschmy Bio here
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what approach would you suggest?

Darren

When conservatives state that they use their values as the basis for their policies, doesn't that open them up for legitimate discussion and questioning?  

Am I wrong in saying that  Conservative Values have failed?

Are you calling them successful?

what approach would you suggest in discussing the values they say are the basis of all their policies?  and how do you grow and learn from your mistakes if you don't question?

 

 

 

by Edwin Rutsch (61 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 151 comments) on Thursday, April 24, 2008 at 12:32:48 AM
 


my Bio here
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Edwin Rutschmy Bio here
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underlying values of thuggery

What do you feel the underlying values of thuggery and the lynch mob are?

by Edwin Rutsch (61 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 151 comments) on Wednesday, April 23, 2008 at 12:57:23 PM
 


Darren Wolfe is the former Eastern Vice Chair of the Libertarian Party of Pennsylvania. He grew up in Puerto Rico and lived in Venezuela for seven years, including the first year of Chavez' rule. His articles have appeared in OpEdNews.com, the Libertarian Penn, and the Nolanchart.com. News services such as the New York Post.com and Rational Review have published links to his work.

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"Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our wi...

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Darren WolfeDarren Wolfe is the former Eastern Vice Chair of the Libertarian Party of Pennsylvania. He grew up in Puerto Rico and lived in Venezuela for seven years, including the first year of Chavez' rule. His articles have appeared in OpEdNews.com, the Libertarian Penn, and the Nolanchart.com. News services such as the New York Post.com and Rational Review have published links to his work.

*****************************

"Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our wi...

to see more of bio, click on member name

Re: underlying values of thuggery

Isn't thuggery the negation of values?

Ayn Rand explained values well:

It is only an ultimate goal, an end in itself, that makes the existence of values possible. Metaphysically, life is the only phenomenon that is an end in itself: a value gained and kept by a constant process of action. Epistemologically, the concept of “value” is genetically dependent upon and derived from the antecedent concept of “life.” To speak of “value” as apart from “life” is worse than a contradiction in terms. “It is only the concept of ‘Life’ that makes the concept of ‘Value’ possible.”

In answer to those philosophers who claim that no relation can be established between ultimate ends or values and the facts of reality, let me stress that the fact that living entities exist and function necessitates the existence of values and of an ultimate value which for any given living entity is its own life. Thus the validation of value judgments is to be achieved by reference to the facts of reality. The fact that a living entity is, determines what it ought to do. So much for the issue of the relation between “is” and “ought.”

Now in what manner does a human being discover the concept of “value”? By what means does he first become aware of the issue of “good or evil” in its simplest form? By means of the physical sensations of pleasure or pain. Just as sensations are the first step of the development of a human consciousness in the realm of cognition, so they are its first step in the realm of evaluation.

The capacity to experience pleasure or pain is innate in a man’s body; it is part of his nature, part of the kind of entity he is. He has no choice about it, and he has no choice about the standard that determines what will make him experience the physical sensation of pleasure or of pain. What is that standard? His life.

 

by Darren Wolfe (5 articles, 151 quicklinks, 92 diaries, 691 comments) on Wednesday, April 23, 2008 at 10:14:48 PM
 


my Bio here
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Edwin Rutschmy Bio here
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no it's not..

 

Bit difficult to follow her thinking at this time of night, but;

 - Values to me are not about good and evil - that's morality and not what I'm interested in. 


 - values to me are felt body experiences,  violence is a value, love, joy, etc.
here is a list of about 4,000 of them
http://www.diversitas.org/db/x.php?dbcode=va&sbmt=1&go=b&ltr=a

by Edwin Rutsch (61 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 151 comments) on Thursday, April 24, 2008 at 12:18:00 AM
 


my Bio here
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Edwin Rutschmy Bio here
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brutality manifesting itself?

Where do you presently see conservative violence and brutality manifesting itself?

by Edwin Rutsch (61 articles, 0 quicklinks, 0 diaries, 151 comments) on Wednesday, April 23, 2008 at 12:58:10 PM
 

 

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